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Moving to Medellin

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jerryg
  12/9/2016 18:38 EST

We are moving to Medellin from Cuenca, Ecuador. We need help finding a house to rent for approx $400 furnished if possible...either a facilitator or a gringo real estate agent.

livinginmedellin
  12/10/2016 10:01 EST

Good luck trying to find a furnished house in Medellín renting for only $400 per month.

You might find a decent unfurnished apartment for that price outside of El Poblado (in Laureles, Envigado or Sabaneta).

Furnished places tend to rent for much higher prices than $400 per month. And houses (casas) tend to be larger than apartments and tend to rent for even higher prices.

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guestuser
  12/10/2016 14:55 EST

I agree that the amount isn't going to be anywhere near enough. Finding a cheap furnished place that will be let to a foreigner captures all kinds of problems that might be difficult to overcome. It's certainly at a level a lot lower than the 'gringo agencies' generally want to talk about, no matter what the area. Increasingly those agencies are focusing on short term (daily and weekly) rentals for tourists as well which isn't helping the situation.

I think that there has been so much commentary and surveys about how 'expensive' Poblado is and other areas are 'such bargains' it's given the impression to people moving here that rental costs are much lower than they actually are. It's a fairly big city but the amount of rentals easily available to foreigners, in areas that are suitable isn't as many as you'd think.

Some people on here have found what they consider 'diamonds' but equally I've come across people who've got very frustrated trying to find a suitable place at a modest price.

Generally you might find it easier to find an apartment as the stock of that is generally greater in the areas you talk about. Beware though that some '2 or 3 bedroomed' apartments - in particular outside of Poblado are often much smaller than you'd expect.

Although of course there's individual preference in Medellin apartments are often more popular than houses because of the security aspect. People have long memories of the past.

cccmedia
  12/10/2016 15:17 EST

Stay in a hotel or a hostal for a couple of days and look with boots on the ground. Trying to do this over the usual Internet sites will not get a good rate.

However, check Spanish language websites instead of fancy Gringo-positioned sites for better rates.

cccmedia from Popayán, COL

jerryg
  12/10/2016 15:20 EST

I would prefer a Spanish site, but would need a facilitator or interrupter. Can anyone help me with that.

PittsburghSound
  12/10/2016 17:44 EST

I know some of the old timers here might poo poo it, but believe it or not, Facebook is a hell of a way to find good rentals. I found apartments here in Bucaramanga through Facebook groups. I am sure that you would be able to do the same in Medellin.

You would pay Colombian prices.

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novato1953
  12/10/2016 18:07 EST

If apartments in Estadio are that expensive, why rent one at all when can you get a nice hotel room on La 70 for $16US a night including maid service, fridge, cable TV, internet, A/C, an answer-man for local best practices down at the front desk, and a shower in a freakin' walk-up bathtub?

cccmedia
  12/10/2016 21:23 EST

Thumbs up on your post about place(s) to stay on la 70, Novato.

A few follow-up questions....

1. What is the name of the place where that ‘experto’ on best practices works?

2. Is that ´hospedaje´ located inside the city limits of Medellín or in a different nearby place?

3. What’s the story on the walk-up shower in a bathtub? Is this a private-baño set-up or something else?

cccmedia from Popayán

JasonWriter
  12/10/2016 21:48 EST

My first apartment in Estadio, after I struck out from an initial roommate situation, was 530 bucks per month, furmishrd, servicios included, with maid service. I was like "cool. I got an apartment!" Then I thought "wait. What's the difference between this and a large hotel room?" Mostly I guess there was no front desk, was the biggest difference. It was right around the same price as the hotels on Setenta. Hotel/furnished apartment seem to be about the same thing around here, in most cases. The only way I found my current apartment, furnished, for 240 per month was by talking to a lot of people and lucking upon a Colombian-American who had a cedula and just so happened to be leaving his apartment and most of his furniture to go back to the States for a year. We worked out a deal and I took over his apartment

SunsetSteve
  12/11/2016 07:15 EST

Jason - what is the nature of "Setenta" street, where you say it is possible to rent a hotel room for longer terms at good rates? I am currently searching online for a place for 4 days or so, and I wonder whether I should be looking at a hotel in that area.

JasonWriter
  12/11/2016 14:10 EST

La 70 is a nightlife strip in Laureles-Estadio. Lot of restaurants, bars, discotecas and bars. And hotels. Usually when you come across a gringo in Medellin who wants to party, they will say "let's go party in Parque Lleras!" Colombians in Medellin are much more likely to say "Let's go party en la 70!" Or on La 33, which is also in Laureles

Hotels on la 70 run about 50,000-90,000 pesos. 60-70 seems about the average

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SunsetSteve
  12/11/2016 16:34 EST

Thanks - I got the right impression then. But in my eagerness I went ahead an booked air bnb at this place - I hope it's not a big mistake:

https://www.airbnb.ca/rooms/10811585?eluid=1&euid=c7df3cc8-56a0-4d3e-f939-cce5859165f4

JasonWriter
  12/11/2016 19:31 EST

Looks cool. You're going to be staying about 2 minutes walking from me, so let me know when you arrive if you want to meet up. I really doubt it could be a mistake, no worries. For the most part, the biggest complaints I hear from people who live in Laureles-Estadio or Poblado are as follows:

Poblado people: I'd rather be in Laureles. Too many gringos here and too expensive. And it's hilly.

Laureles people: I'd rather be in Poblado. I don't mind paying extra for relative luxury. And I like hilliness.

Cab from Laureles to Poblado is about 5 bucks, 25 minute drive. So that'll solve that

joemindwarp
  12/11/2016 19:46 EST

Example
For a full refund of accommodation fees, cancellation must be made five full days prior to listing’s local check in time (or 3:00 PM if not specified) on the day of check in. For example, if check-in is on Friday, cancel by the previous Sunday before check in time.

timllowe
  12/11/2016 19:52 EST

My experience with gringo imports to Colombia is mixed at best. Groupon works great. Uber is actyally better. AirBNB has been mostly a disappointment with no responses and pretty dishonest descriptions when they do. I don't recommend it.

JasonWriter
  12/12/2016 00:17 EST

I should have added: I also hear quite a few people who live in Laureles talking about a desire to move to, wait for it....Centro.

These are always younger people, 20s, 30s, 40s max, and they always speak a good amount of Spanish. It seems like a sort of trendy hipster desire, in the same way hipsters in Mexico and San Diego started "taking back" Tijuana, or the way Detroit is considered by many young Americans to be a cool, rebellious, cheap scene. I came across a 30-something Hispanic-Canadian expat the other day who first moved to Poblado when he arrived 6 years ago, then quickly moved to Laureles, and after a few years in Medellin, finally decided he wanted to live in Centro. Cheap rent, big apartment, tons of crack addicts walking around his neighborhood but he says he's learned to deal with them. In fact, one of his favorite activities is sitting on his roof with his friends, smoking weed and listening to music, while watching the crack addicts tottering around in the streets below like something out of a post-apocalyptic film. Walking Dead: Medellin. I've heard this Centro desire from quite a few now

cccmedia
  12/12/2016 01:25 EST

Talk is cheap, Jason .. and by that i refer to the guys who are ‘talking’ about Centro.

The concept of hanging around the drug scene in Colombia -- in Medellín, yet -- seriously?

Let’s all do the right thing .. and not go beggin’ for trouble.

cccmedia from Popayán

guestuser
  12/12/2016 03:30 EST

I agree with @ccm

For the short time you've been here Jason you seem to have gathered some interesting feedback.

You're fairly young and therefore rather in the minority of ex pats moving here. Putting into anyone's mind that Centro is some sort of new 'destination' - and in particular for older peopl moving here - is ridiculous. Centro and adjoining zones is really a sad story - there are some wonderful buildings in and around the district but it's a no-go zone for the majority of ex-pats to live. Talk to locals who used to own lovely family houses there and had to move out and although they often still own the properties I promise you they're not planning to move back.

Despite all this hipster interest it's noticeable that there doesn't seem to be a lot of interest in City Hall in making the area a development zone any time soon, which would happen just about anywhere else. They'd rather take an area like Industriales (a much better suggestion for ex pats) for development than try to sort out the mess that El Centro is. One day it will get fixed - the trams being the starter of some sort of investment - but I guess most retirees may be long dead by the time it happens.

If you read the local papers - and I'd suggest that it's something that ex pats attempt despite the language struggle - Medellin is currently suffering a crime wave. There have been some high visibility hold ups recently - the largest one on the road up from Envigado towards the airport and there have been more than the normal amount of armed guys on motos holding up cars in Poblado. For locals it's worrying and there were some significant articles in the press over the weekend..

Why there's this sudden increase isn't obvious. Maybe it's collecting money for 'Xmas. Maybe in Poblado its an offshoot of the current traffic issues with all of the road 'improvements' which has slowed traffic and made it easier for the bad guys on the motos. Maybe it's the ongoing economic squeeze on the majority of people.

But I'll argue now isn't the time to start getting too experimental with living in Medellin.

How cheap your rent is doesn't tend to be your major preoccupation when you're on the ground with a gun at your head and someone going through your pockets looking for valuables. And if we're seeing issues in districts like Poblado and Enviagado it's certainly not about to get better in the other zones and unfortunately as Gringos we're rather obvious targets.

timllowe
  12/12/2016 11:09 EST

Paradise, I must respectfully but completely disagree with you. Gentrification of once "down" barrios has come to larger Colombian cities and is spreading fast. Young professionals buying up cheap property in urban areas and turning them around. They would rather save an old house than live in a wealthier area with people they frankly have little in common with. I don't expect most of the old people on this forum to want to play urban pioneer but it's wrong to discourage younger people from doing so.

My advice is to look for a smart little coffee shop in an edgy neighborhood. It's a good indication that it's on it's way up. City administrations never improve neighborhoods. Not in the US and not in Colombia. Young people looking for cheap housing and urban lifestyle always lead the charge.

When they build a McDonalds, a Subway and a Juan Valdez, it's too late.

guestuser
  12/12/2016 11:45 EST

@tl how much time have you spent in Centro?

There are 'down barrios' and those that are pretty much beyond redemption - at least without some kick starter money from Government. And there's none coming to Centro immediately. It's just too big to fix. And when they do fix it it's going to be lots of wrecking balls, compulsory purchase and big apartments.

I know a young professional who - in an attempt to get on the housing ladder - bought into the area. Within 6 months she wanted out because of the issues of living there and you know what - she can't sell.

My wife has inherited property in the area. Our plan - give it to charity - it's more aggravation than it's worth. And it's not worth much.

Some large Colombian corporations still maintain buildings in Centro. Want to know what young professionals consider 'constructive dismissal' here? Being moved out of the nice building in Industriales to the one in Centro.

Incidentally if you read the post properly (something you sometimes don't do) I made a very clear distinction in the second sentence about the the poster being much younger than most of those on this forum and that this was not good advice 'in particular for older people moving here'.

There is a city plan for Medellin and the areas for redevelopment with those nice little coffee shops have already been identified. Nothing to stop people investing in Centro if they want to take the risk - and a very, very long term view. But in Medellin I'd suggest the rule is to go with what the City wants you to do. There's a lot to do to upgrade Medellin and it won't all happen at once.

Incidentally if anyone wanted to take a punt on Medellin they'd be looking at Prado. Gorgeous architecture and the jewel of the city from the 1930-1950. It adjoins Centro. But these days many of the houses are abandoned or in great need of work. If you read many guide books they will tell you not to go there. But that area will emerge before Centro.

timllowe
  12/12/2016 12:06 EST

I doubt I've spent more than an hour there. I don't spend time in Medellin. I have spent a lot of time in the more notorious barrios in Cali. Siloe, famed in song and literature as the "baddest" barrio in Cali is the subject of three of my photography exhibits. That said, there are numerous barrios in Cali I wouldn't go to with an armed guard. Mostly because you couldn't find on. The police won't even go into Aguablanca and neither will I.

My point is that there is a lot of urban gentrification going on in Colombia and just because the old folks won't go there doesn't mean it's still a bad place. Being an urban pioneer has it's pluses and minuses but it's a very valid way to go.

When I tell people where I live, most Colombians say they are surprised a gringo would live there but it's a very nice town.

mtbe
  12/12/2016 12:09 EST

I've been seeing what Tim has seen as well. Some of the more depressed areas are being revitalized. If not be the gov't, then by private investors.

It's happening in Bogota, there's some discussion in Pereira. But those have mainly been gov't actions or gov't working with private investors. Kinda similar to 'old city' in Panama city....it was a drug haven, but now it's quite nice to walk around. Or similar to Detroit, as someone mentioned already. I don't know anything about Centro to know what's going on there.

But, it is happening, just like in the States. Warehouse districts are now the up and coming condo districts, etc...

Unfortunately, this 'clean up' effort makes it even harder for those who have been displaced already...and are being displaced again.

timllowe
  12/12/2016 12:33 EST

Colombia is late to historic preservation. I've spent many an afternoon at el Valle departmental library pouring over old fotos of el Centro and seeing all the wonderful buildings that are no more.

I used to teach photography in the school of architecture at U. San Bueanaventura and almost all my students had summer jobs from the government. About half identified, photographed and geo-tagged substandard rural housing as part of a government study for targeting housing funds. The others worked for a program under the alcalde de Cali to identify abandoned historic buildings that were structurally sound and candidates for city funding for rehabilitation.

There are now SOME protected historic areas. Barrio San Antonio in Cali and the old centro de Popayan come to mind.

Most historic preservation is done by urban professionals looking for a cool place to live. Lots of architects will do pro bono work in helping people evaluate urban historic homes for rehab.

novato1953
  12/12/2016 13:13 EST

Rooms can be had at $4US a night in El Centro, and it's no wonder. I'm from Detroit myself, and anyone who looks at El Centro today and doesn't register that it's a dangerous neighborhood just isn't paying attention.

guestuser
  12/12/2016 14:37 EST

@tl the problem with Colombia was that - at least in the past - there's not much evidence of Urban Planning. So as areas like El Centro grew no one was very focused on trying to preserve any charm that existed. Even the really interesting historic buildings around Parque Berrio got ruined with sight lines when they built the metro on overhead rails. It was cheaper to build it that way course, rather than going underground or disrupting the center at ground level but like any development like that it sort of tears the area in half and just makes it look ugly. Centro used to have the best hotels (like Nutribara) and used to be fashionable but its downfall was fast.

Medellin is and was the Industrial City but even there isn't much evidence of recycling old character buildings into something for the future. Outside the Modern Art Museum for example there's a small preserved arch from a factory that was replaced but it really just looks a bit naff.

So unlike in some other Latin countries (like Santiago) Centro doesn't have a lot of the culture left so the idea of a pleasant cultural center is going to be difficult to rebuild with coffee shops, vape shops and barber shops.

The biggest development area at the moment with pleasant cafes, barber shops, fashion shops? Yes, good old much unloved 'gringolandia' Parque Lleras (the place where Colombians are never meant to go to) where there's construction going on everywhere.

The reason? It's the middle and upper middle class professionals who have the money and that's where they like to go in the evening. The development and the investment follows the money.

timllowe
  12/12/2016 15:31 EST

This is finally changing in Cali. The government is quite progressive and things are starting to change fast. The one barrio that won't be saved is our el centro. There isn't much there to save. It is a fun area but visually and architecturally it's a mess. I saw a master plan that would pretty much knock the whole thing down. The interesting thing is that just up the hill from el Centro is a historic neighborhood (La Merced) and then the actual protected barrio San Antonio. Going to be interesting to see how glass and steel harmonizes with it's 18th century neighbors.

Of course if the reconstruction of el centro de Cali goes like any other construction project in Colombia, I won't be around to see it. ;)

JasonWriter
  12/12/2016 16:01 EST

Yeah, I've only been here 5 months. My usual caveat emptor to readers. Just sharing what I see/hear on the ground. Personally, I wouldn't advise anyone to move to Centro. That's usually the sort of thing that someone decides to do after they know damn well what they're getting themselves into.

JasonWriter
  12/12/2016 16:13 EST

@ PL, I think the fact that I noted there are "crack addicts tottering around everywhere in Centro" gave a pretty clear signal to those, young or old, on the general vibe of Centro at night. That wasn't exactly a Kerouac passage on the hip, raw jazz scene of Centro and the endless opportunities there

SunsetSteve
  12/12/2016 17:13 EST

Nothing Jason wrote had any effect on me other than some insight into an area called "Centro", and in no way tempted me to explore there. I don't see how his description could be seen as enticing old buggers like me to venture there.

guestuser
  12/12/2016 18:10 EST

@ss not convinced by the cool, rebellious, cheap scene'?

Still it makes a change to talk about another zone rather than reading the endless cheap shots at Poblado. And there's some arguement that it is a post that's on subject. Where we started was 'where can I get a house for $400 a month?'

Funnily enough Centro might be the answer.

JasonWriter
  12/12/2016 18:31 EST

Tim, as usual, is good at keeping the forum in perspective. The majority of posters here are older, wealthy dudes. Which can provide invaluable info in many ways, but will also skew opinions in a certain direction.

Me: A Canadian expat I ran into the other day says he likes living in Centro. He seems to treat it like a rebellious scene, like several other young people I've met in Medellin. One thing he likes about living there is watching the zombies that flood the streets on a daily basis. He says he doesn't mind the zombies anymore.

Response: There you doggone whippersnappers go again! Trying to entice older folks to move to Centro!

timllowe
  12/12/2016 18:59 EST

A certain direction? You mean: RIGHT? ;)

SunsetSteve
  12/12/2016 19:08 EST

Centre-left.

timllowe
  12/12/2016 19:25 EST

Center-left is the worst kind of equivocation. I'd rather have Uribe. At least he tried to kill the m=therf=ckers.

guestuser
  12/12/2016 22:20 EST

@jason where do you get the idea that the posters here are 'wealthy older dudes'.?

In my time in Medellin I've always been amazed how modest the means are of many of the ex pats (and posters). More than a few, perhaps even the majority live from social security check to check.

Most of them live a far better life than they would in the US. Many of them are Conservative, with a big 'C' but most (other than in Colombian terms) would ever qualify as wealthy.

Perhaps you need to widen the ex pats that you mix with. Ultimately, unless there's a special circumstance like a Colombian partner Colombia and Medellin are anything but an obvious choice for wealthy ex pats. If nothing else security and the tax situation means there are many other attractive alternatives for the well heeled.

novato1953
  12/12/2016 22:32 EST

Somebody once told me ex-pat North Americans in Latin America tend to be thousandaires who want to live like millionaires.

JasonWriter
  12/13/2016 04:54 EST

My apologies, PL. I misspoke. Older men, not older wealthy men.

At any rate, go back and read this thread. I simply relayed an anecdote about conversations I've had with expats here, and you somehow decided I was leading gringos astray, seducing them to visit or invest in Centro. Really, the only invitation I offered, clearly, was to yet another windbag lecture from you. You love to hear yourself talk. Great, I respect that. But go back and read this thread. What you should have typed was,

"I would now like to give a lecture on Centro. It now commences..."

Instead of trying to angle it as an indignant response to me. Please, accurately label the lectures. I enjoy them save for that disingenuousness.

WhoaNellie
  12/13/2016 10:08 EST

Jason says: "You love to hear yourself talk."

Ja ja, pot, kettle, black...

Bobfrozen1
  12/14/2016 07:16 EST

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/60-minutes-colombia-after-civil-war-lara-logan/

Didn't know which thread to post this link in but did remember some discussion on this thread as to urban renewal. Around 9 minutes into the video it talks about Medellin. It shows how far this wonderful country has come.

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