Egypt Expat Forum - here we go again english woman and egyptian man

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yazz1972
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11/10/2011 09:43    
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i have been searching the net and found hundreds of dissaster stories of british women and egyptian men. im going to start posting on this site as i am at the very beginning of a relationship if you can call it that with an egyptian and i want those interested to see how it pans out and would appreciate sensible comments. i am a muslim woman, born in the uk. i have 2 properties, 3 grown up children, 2 good jobs and a very good life. i have been single for 7 years and had given p hope on finding my soul mate about a year ago. im not stupid, im very down to earth and ive been round the block. im very independent as are my daughters and i am very wary of men from any background as i have had a few bad experiences in the past with men living in the uk. ive been on dating sites but have never felt any chemistry with anyone. i have been to egypt 4 times. twice with my daughters and twice on my own. i love the country, i feel at home there, and the locals think im egyptian and imediately speek arabic to me untill i tell them im english, then they dont believe me. lol. i went to sharm in october 2011, not wanting to meet anyone, i am well aware of the fraudsters in sharm, the good looking young men, charming, out to get my money ect. i wanted a rest. but then i met mahmoud who works at the pool. he told me off for not having my pool card. lol the next day i gave him my pool card and later we had a brief chat. he was very serious, like an old head on young shoulders. he is religouse and always went to pray. he asked if i wasnt doing anything later we could go for a coffee. i took his number but didnt call him, i went shopping instead. the next morning i had flowers on my balcony form mahmoud. he said he waited fr my call, i explained i wasnt looking for a man to go out with. we chatted at points throuout the day, although he wasnt allowed to talk to me too much. in the evening i had no plans so thought what the heck, he seems nice, we get along, hes not immature, so i txted him and we met and went out for a coffee by the sea. ok, here we go...WOW ive never felt chemistry like this before. we talked for hours. hes very religious as i am, we spoke about the differences between the life of a woman in egypt and in england. he has his views and i have mine but the discussion was good and he was wrong and knew it. he was to get married a month before and had set up his flat for his new wife. but the marraige didnt happen as he told me he didnt want to marry her, she was only 18 and wanted to go clubbing and he was not interested in such things.but his father wanted him to marry her. the relationship broke down and the marraige was off. she has since married someone else. for the rest of the time i was there, we spent days and evenings going out together. i never gave him any money, he never asked for money. only one time, i offered to take HIM out for dinner, as i wanted to go to an expensive restaraunt id seen. I ended up paying for half of it and he payed the rest. WE NEVER HAD SEX, and he never stayed the night with me. no sex before marraige ect. we grew more attracted to each other, and the chemistry got stonger. I cant belive it but on the last day i cried when i had to leave, i cried on the plane because i felt id found the man ive been looking for. we are in touch every day. he hasnt asked me for anything but to send him a photo of me by email. i am going back in february. mahmoud has asked me if he can take me to meet his family. i said yes as id like to see where he actualy comes from. sometimes i feel like a right idiod, stupid british woman, who thinks this man feels something for her. dont want to make any mistakes. everything i have is for my children and always will be, but i miss him sooo much and have never felt this for any man , not even my childrens father, that wasnt love. i would not leave my children and go to egypt, i have too much to lose. if he askes for anything or anything changes before i go in feb2012 il will post it on here. thankyou, and sorry for an epic email!!! will keep you posted.
yazz

yazz1972
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11/10/2011 10:10    
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by the way, hes 30 and im 37. and yes i posted that story as i have doubts after reading disaster after disaster. initail thoughts please.

Doddy
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11/10/2011 13:53    
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Hi there, I'm a British/Egyptian and I have been married to my English wife for 12 years. I also have number of Egyptian friends are or have been married to British women for considerable period of time. I have never asked my wife for money, I work hard to provide good level of living for my wife and my child. The majority of friend also are hard workers and they take well care of their families. I meet my wife in the United State, and all my friends have meet their wifes here in the UK or in the USA.
Your story is very familiar to me, I have heard number of similar stories back home in Egypt and here in the UK. In addition, I know number of Egyptian guys here in the Uk were married to forign women in Sharm and Luxor. Very few of these guys continued in their marriages. They have used these venerable women as a bridge to come to the UK. Neither myself nor anyone else could tell you what will happen in the future, however, from where your story has begun I could tell you that it's a very similar story what I previously heard. Be careful and just consider people's advice. Good luck

RaheliOmSarah
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11/10/2011 16:32    
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Every man and woman is unique, in Egypt as well as the rest of the world. I am married to a younger Egyptian man, from a wonderful family, who all love and respect me and treat me like a queen. The thing is, we knew each other for 5 years before we got married. During that time, he went to Saudi Arabia, and worked very hard, sacrificing much for money to give his sister a nice wedding and good dowry, and for our wedding and honeymoon time together sightseeing and vacation. He is educated though, very well with a Master's Degree and Post graduate diploma.
My daughter's father died when she was a baby, and Medo (my husband) has taken on the role of father, and although Islam usually doesn't allow for adoption of children, changing their name etc., he is willing to do that if she so chooses. He ALWAYS supports us, in every way. Financially, emotionally and generously. He works hard, and as the eldest son (his family are very traditional Egyptians and good Muslims), he supports his parents, and my mother who is elderly and widowed. Although he and I have an even greater age ratio than you (I'm older), it doesn't matter to him, nor to his family at all!

The prophet Mohamed, PBUH married a woman 25 years his senior. She was his only wife, and I'm sure they had genuine love between them for their entire marriage of 25+ years.
If a man is a good, genuine Arab, according to TRADITIONAL standards, he will be an excellent husband, as mine is! He, and his entire extended family, have become beloved members of my extended family here. My Egyptian family is kind, loving to a fault, and although much poorer than some, and my m-i-l is illiterate, they are sooo generous with my daughter, whom they love and claim as their own.

I'm Jewish, and my husband and inlaws all have respect for our religion and traditions, because we are 'people of the book'. I was married to an American for 5 years before, and there is NOOOOO comparison.

Medo is an Arab man, a genuine man. My daughter and I met (now) our whole family there, 4 years before we married. We had a big traditional Egyptian wedding, after the Henna party.

After that, he worked in Saudi Arabia for 3 years (a necessary sacrifice for us so that he could fulfill all of his family obligations, we had a legal "wedding contract" signed in Cairo, before a Judge in the Marriage It's the only marriage accepted by the American govt. Standardized, if you will, to reduce the fraudulent "visa weddings".
Many years ago, when we first met, I must admit to having been skeptical, because of the difference in our ages, religions, and cultures. Every case is different, and actions speak louder than words!!

Just be sure you don't ever try to "lie to yourself" or "make justifications" for any of your gut ( previously typo'd "guy") instinct! I did that with my previous (American) husband, and ended up having a very challenging, not-so-good marriage. There are good people, and bad people in EVERY race and culture. If you trust your own judgment, don't worry about anyone else and their situation. Just be honest with yourself, and when you meet the "right man" from ANY race/culture, enjoy your life together!
OF COURSE, there is a lot of room for misunderstandings of different culture, customs and traditions and the first years of getting to know one another can be challenging!! HOWEVER, if you BOTH have self-respect, and respect for one another, you'll grow all the closer for having learned to understand!
I wish you all the best!!!
Racheli om Sarah

yazz1972
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11/11/2011 06:06    
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racheli, thankyou so much

yazz1972
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11/11/2011 06:14    
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update. spoke on the phone last night. he never mentions money so i wanted to ask a leading question. i asked how much do you earn in a month mahmoud? he replied. i earn enough habibi, dont worry, when you come i will look after you. so i though ahhh how sweet, but i told him we look after each other. then there was no more talk about money. i must say his reply pleased me and i believe it was genuine. thanks to all the replies, it realy helps.

RaheliOmSarah
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11/11/2011 10:13    
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helane
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11/10/2011 16:40

trust me when I tell u that your entire story could be my story...except I met my Egyptian on the tram. Yes it can work out with you and him...there are a few,and I mean a few honest sincere Egyptian men that can really make great husbands. I am an American Muslim who married my Egyptian husband not too long ago after going back and forth for 2 years...finally I moved to Alex to be with him...life is too short and you will always be asking yourself What if? so,I say..give it an honest chance with him..Good luck


I moved this to the correct thread, it was on the next one about coming to cairo...

boudica
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11/11/2011 17:41    
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Totally agree with you. I am from SA and my fiance from Alex. We have been together now for a few years and plan to be married in December . I am moving to Alex on December 4th. We are very much in love and i would not trade him for all the gold in Fort Knox.. Moh has never once asked me for money or asked me to pay for anything at all. I have a daughter of 22 yrs and he actualy asked me to sign my properties over to her as he wants to support me as he feels that is the man's 'job' so to speak. Yes, it is going to be hard living for the first couple of months, I realise that much, but am ready and prepared to do all to ensure our happiness. My only one big fear is now to find myself a job in Alex! lol

yazz1972
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11/12/2011 12:45    
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hi boudica,

sounds like you found a good one. And its good to hear positive replies. congratulations for december. please keep me posted if you can. i wouldnt be able to move to egypt, mabey when i retire if me and mahmoud are together, but i couldnt leave my girls for a long time yet. although i think its hard for the egyptians to come over to the uk, but that would be ideal. theres me thinking way ahead of myself, but i like to know whats what. Youre very brave leaving SA though, you two must realy be in love. thank you again for the reply.
yasmeen

Marro
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12/5/2011 18:15    
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Dear Yazz

i am egyptian male , and i am familiar with the culture , and i can say you found a good one , as he did not look for making love with you. and i suggest you can go forward with the relation,
However, he will be thinking of you helping him to move with you to uk , and he can find job there. and there will be the real test for your love, is it going to syurvive for long time or not!!!
i think it is a normal relation between a man and a woman regardless the money or nationality and as long as you are attracted you will have all the honey.

Best Wishes
But

yazz1972
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12/6/2011 07:58    
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thank you marro.
all is still good so far. im going in february. actually hed rather i go to egypt to live, but i wouldnt untill i retire and my children are settled. so if it goes well i prob will get him to come over for a holiday first and see how it goes.

Joabdalla
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2/20/2012 08:37    
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Hi Yazz .. I have been reading in this forum for a few weeks now but never felt the need to register until I read your post .

Im an English British Christan who also met my Hubby in Egypt .
I'm sick to death of reading the horror disaster stories of relationships between Egyptians Men and European women .

Just to give you a brief background , I met him whilst I was separated from my first husband and I was on holiday with my mum , dad , my two girls and our very close friends . My hubby was drawn to the fact that we were a very close family and shared values of family life . We kept in touch and developed a huge friendship that built into something I will never be able to describe in words.

Over 1 year I travelled back and forth , visiting his family was a big issue for us as they initially had massive reservations about him marrying out of his culture and religion but once they met me and understood that I had good intentions and didn't just want him for fun they welcomed me with open arms .

We decided to get married quite early in in the relationship, the problem was all the red tape and legal stuff to arrange and to ultimately make a decision where to get married . It was important to my family for us to get married in the Uk so we made all the arrangements and we made the huge decision to live permanatly in the uk .

Contrary to popular belief not all Egyptian men want a visa and to leave Egypt and it was heartbreaking for us as a family to say goodbye to his family . Just because they are men and live in sometimes near poverty conditions does not help when a true Egyptian man has to leave his mother and grandmother :-( that's a day I will never forget .

We were married 3 weeks later in my church but the day was marred with a little sadness as half of our family were missing ... People seem to forget these sacrifices that these Egyptian men have to do when they emigrate to a different country with not one family member at their wedding :-(

Anyway we have been happily married in the uk for over 2 years now the chemistry that we felt when we first met is still there , he's taken on the perfect role to my two girls as a step dad and they totally all adore each other ...so up to now you have a success story at last !!!!!

The one bit of advice I would give you and it's got nothing to do with money it's prepare yourself for each time you visit to have your heart ripped out at the airport .. It's a long flight home :-( please let me know how you get on and I wish you luck happiness in your future with your soul mate xxx

yazz1972
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2/28/2012 08:21    
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hi everyone. an update and some advice needed. so i went back to see my egyptian friend on feb 14th 2012. signed a contract so we could be together and left on 21st feb. well what can i say, i had a fantastic time. very emotional goodbye for both of us. hes a practising muslim as am i, he didnt leave my side for the 8 days only to go to the mosque on friday. loved up, yes. hes respectfull, can be moody but thats nothing compared to what ive been through in the past. he has been very reluctant to come to london for a holiday. i had to explain why i couldnt keep comming back to egypt, due to work ect. in the end i had to ask his uncle if mahmoud can come to london. he said no then i explained it would just be for 1 week, he then agreed. mahmoud would have said yes anyway. ok everyone is telling him how its soooo hard to get a visitors visa, hes realy put off and worried about it. ive got togather my bank statements, wage slips, house documents and copy of my passport. i know i have to write a letter of invitation but im not sure how detailed this should be. do i have to prove that weve met, that weve txted? i have a pay as you go phone so cant show them any bills that ive called him. also we met in oct 2011, is that too short a time to be trying to get a visa for him? do i need to send anything else. also, he never asked me for anything. after 4 days of spending his money on me, i just knew he had run out as he didnt want to go out anymore. lol! but i took over from there. i felt we should look after each other. not all on him and not all on me. hes a decent man and i love him, and miss him way too much. i wake up sad every day as i dont know when il see him again or if his visa will be refused. i feel kind of lost at the moment. can anyone give me some advice on the visa application. do you know why so many egyptians get turned down. and what i could do to have the best possible chance of getting the visa for him. hes getting his papers ready aswell. i only need him to come for a week. then il go back and see him in egypt. thanks so much everyone,

Joabdalla
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2/28/2012 08:53    
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Hi

I posted some info to you last week but it seems to have got lost in cyber space !!

To be successful applying for a visitor visa for someone that is in a relationship you need to prove that he has links back to his own country . Also a letter from his employer giving him permission to take time off work which should include his expected date he is to return to work .

Any letters from his family members would also help with the content expressing their acceptance of his visit and the purpose of it .


Any bank statements or official documents showing any funds he has or land he owns in his name would be useful but if not as long as you can prove you have the means to support him on his holiday would be fine . Include any photos of your house .

There is a question on the application form which states who will pay for your trip ! Just answer honestly if you are paying and include the details of where he will be staying in your letter .

If your children know of this relationship then ask them to write a letter also explaining that they would love to meet him .

In your letter of invitation start it with dear British Embassy ... I would like you to consider issuing .....bla bla ...with a visitor visa to visit me in the Uk for the purpose of a holiday ...... Then continue on with your story , I would be as honest as possible in your letter .

Just a reminder any documents that he provides needs to be translated into English alongside the original .

Your pay as you go phone can be requested as a statement it costs around £10 all you have to do is phone customer services and they will advise you ... Think you have to request it in writing !

Print off some screen shots if you chatting online if you use a web can !

Basically what they are looking for when they issue a visitor visa is the likely hood that he will return back to Egypt . The visa is for a min of 6 months but as long as he can prove his ties back to his country they should have no reasons to refuse .

We was refused a visitor visa on the grounds of us having a genuine relationship and the face we didn't provide any documents that proved he would return . So the next one we applied for was a fiancé visa which they couldn't very well refuse as they had already admitted that our relationship was genuine !!

If you need any more advice please don't hesitate to contact me xx Jo xx

ruthgaunt
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4/20/2012 10:55    
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I am doing it too.

I met my man whilst I was on holiday - I fly out on 9th May to marry him.

I have heard all the scare stories but I would rather regret doing this than not doing it.

I am frightened - I am leaving my 4 grown up children here in the UK and I will miss them sooooo much but I have been single for too long.

Wish me luck! If any of you are in Luxor get in touch!

Hettie
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4/21/2012 04:08    
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Some stories are true, but not all men are like that.
Please note if you buy a house, let translate everything and make sure the contract on your name.
I am whit my Egyptian husband now for 4 years, unfortunately I can not live in Egypt.
I wish you much happiness and wisdom.

Greetings Hettie

ruthgaunt
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4/24/2012 06:39    
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I am so glad I have found this thread.

Everyone around me says they 'hope' all goes well for me and Ayman, but they all believe that it will turn into one of the disaster stories - it is so good to hear that there are good outcomes too.

One thing I am sure of is that he is not just after a visa - he doesn't want to walk away from his role as head of his family in Egypt - his mother, brother and 3 sisters depend on him - I have no idea what happened to the dad.

He knows I am poor by UK standards - I have no property or savings - so if he is after money he is out of luck.

I am going on my gut instinct - when I am with him we communicate without needing to talk, I feel safe, loved and cherished.

I fly out to Luxor to marry him in 15 days - this is going to be the hardest thing to do as I leave my 4 grown up (ish) children here. My daughter is trying to be supportive but it is breaking her heart too. My sons don't seem to mind!

I have converted to Islam, and this has helped me a great deal - I feel at peace with my decision and in-shh-allah all will be well.

Wish me luck . . .

boudica
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4/26/2012 12:59    
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Hi. Congratulations and good luck to both of you. I got married to my husband 5 months ago and live in Alexandria. Mine is a success story as we truly love each other very much and are very happy. My husband is a gem and will do anything for his wife. Yes, there are a lot of scam artists and if a western woman is not careful she will be taken in. Just take care and be sure his family also accepts you. Remember eastern men are very close to their mothers and that is not a bad thing but, be sure you can handle that. Here's wishing you all the best for lifelong happiness. Aisha

boudica
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4/26/2012 13:14    
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Hi there! Good luck to you and Ayman. I do know an Ayman from Luxor ..... sounds a lot like him and his situation. Maybe the same guy? lol would that not be something. Tell me more about YOUR Ayman. Would be great if it is the same guy ... we could all meet?

juanmegel
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4/26/2012 21:35    
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Greet boudica ,..
but i'm not Ayman i'm Ahmed it's diffrent more y, a, nd n
and i don't know him but anyway thank you for compilmo
and really want to meet you and sit wz u and talk 2 u
coz i see you are friendly
want is this your real name bodica

boudica
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4/27/2012 18:13    
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hi Ahmed ur girlfriend called u ayman from luck though and her description of u is the same as my friend Ayman from the same area, my mistake sorry......

juanmegel
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4/28/2012 17:27    
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you are welcome body
ayman ayman no problem :)

do you have facebook account add me
make search
herr.ahmed@gmx.de

boudica
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4/29/2012 15:09    
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If it is okay with your fiance then I would not mind adding you Ayman. All the best of luck to you guys with the wedding. Let me know how all went.

peggers
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10/5/2012 21:13    
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firstly im so glad finding this thread, im currently living and working in egypt hurghada, the purpose of my move here was for work and experience. After hearing all the horror stories of Egyptian husbands etc. i came out here keeping myself to myself and not evening giving anybody the chance. Sometimes you come across people that just blow your mind away and thats what happened to me when i met ahmed he also worked in the same hotel i was working in. Me being english im a friendly person and like to make a effort with people which i did and i became such good friends with ahmed, we met in coffee shops, shopping etc. never asked for anything, continued to be such good friends, 1 year down the line im currently engaged to be married, his family are lovely and he has the acceptance from my family also. Yes we both come from completely different cultures and backgrounds and sometimes things clash but you just take every step as it comes, the most important thing is we both understand each others views and opinions. Work and living is hard in egypt, we both are on very low salary's and the cost of living does break the bank a little but we get by, we love each and thats how we get through it. My family invited for us both to come to the UK for christmas (thats right my family, not me) and to pay for our tickets as a gift, me and ahmed both spoke and we agreed this is something we would both love to do but right now money is hard for us, so we agreed we would continue to save money and apply for his visiting visa perhaps in the new year. I wouldnt change anything for the world, i have my marriage and a visit to England to look forward too, wish me luck!
good luck to you also!

dreamsofcreation
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10/14/2012 03:38    
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Hi everyone,
I'm new to the forum and wanted to share my story too. I met an Egyptian 28 male 1st September over the internet, I am 35 in Oz, I did not think much 1st until he began email me everyday and then lead to calling me everyday. He did not ask for anything other than to see me everyday on skype. (And I do not use Skype, but thought would see where it goes). But asked to meet me and travel to him in December to and he would pay for everything when I arrive for 1 month. I just pay for the trip over there from Oz and back. He asked for me to give him a chance because I am very cautious have read alot on the internet and had my fair share of battles in love, and are a smart woman. So I agreed with giving him a chance and will go to meet him in December. So although its a scary thing I feel something different about him and have found him to be genuine so far, so in saying this I really want to take my time and really make sure that this is the real thing. I will let you know how my trip goes in December, I am due to arrive 1st December although he wanted me to visit him this month, I said December is better so I will keep you posted. I agree about the stories on here and would like to thank everyone for your blogs, good and bad. It helps me alot to see the bigger picture and the love the romantic love stories as I am a true romantic at heart, I wish you all the very best in love.
Mirree x

Irma
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10/14/2012 06:07    
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give him a change ánd take care. I am Dutch and planning te be in Egypt from 2- 12 december. Where will you be in Egypt? Do you have friends in Egypt from your own country? Just take care !!

dreamsofcreation
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10/14/2012 07:09    
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Hi Irma,
I will be coming from Australia and staying in Cairo for the month, I do not have any friends in Egypt, I am open to meet honest friends for a chat and coffee.
Mirree x

melissa1984
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10/16/2012 08:29    
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Just as long as you stay wary, this could be ok. Don't sign anything. Remember all contracts are binding and benefit the man. It took me years to understand that most of the men want a financial boost up and easy sex. The religious and cultural differences are HUGE and most women live terrible lives (in upper egypt especially). Life is far better in your country and while I love Egypt, men and women are not equal in this country, even amongst the educated.
And the religious differences and language barriers create isolation for many foreigners. Stay honest with yourself and follow your intuition. If he ever asks for money or tries to push you about anything, be wary. Best of luck, Melissa p.s. remember words are cheap

boudica
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10/16/2012 11:04    
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Hi, I have been living and working in Alexandria for one year now. My fiance is great and i love him to bits. His love for me I am sure of as well. He had never once asked me for money. However, I love with him and his parents and it is very very hard. The cultural differences are enormous. His parents are very good to me, not a problem there, but we are not even allowed to hold hands,let alone being alone together. I do not know how long I can still live this type of life. My love for him keeps me here, but I am not happy. You be very, very, very careful. No matter what his friends or family might say to you, you are still not Egyptian and that counts against you. Believe me. I know

melissa1984
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10/16/2012 22:50    
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I agree with everything you are saying. Can you move into your own place? Melissa

dreamsofcreation
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10/21/2012 02:43    
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Thanx Melissa,
I won't be signing any contracts until I know every little detail because I am well aware of the money and sex to get ahead bull**** that some guys play, I've learnt the hard way too, here in my own country in Australia. But I must say I don't regret it because it has taught me to respect myself more and put myself 1st always and that has really changed me to attract a better person. I leave on the 1st of December, I'd loved to catch up with some girlfriends in Cairo, especially anyone already living there, its always so nice to get a woman's perspective on things.
Ciao Mirree x

dreamsofcreation
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10/21/2012 02:50    
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Thanx Boudica,
That is so good to know also, because he has talked about marriage and living in Egypt, but I was thinking it would be smarter to buy my own apartment in Egypt and live away from the family, that way he can come and visit me to get away from family and work. And it would mean I can still have my own freedom. Yes foreigners can be seen as outsiders, but if you play your cards right, I am sure you find a smart way to create a better situation so that your love is not cramped. I understand this because this is something that I do not want if I decide to take the relationship further. I am already planning ahead so that I have the best possible outcome for myself and my love. Love needs to breathe and have lots of natural sunlight and fresh air, to feel comfortable and nurtured.
Mirree x

Irma
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10/21/2012 11:53    
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you wrote "smarter to buy my own apartment in Egypt" ; well thats not easy at all, so do not do it in your first time in Egypt, and if you have; do you think he will be able to stay in your appartment: that is "forbidden"when you are not married

dreamsofcreation
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10/21/2012 18:07    
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Hi Irma,
I like to plan ahead so nothing will be taking place in a hurry, do not worry dear.
Will you be going to Cairo with friends from your country?
Mirree x

Becs1975
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12/7/2012 05:20    
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am with an Egyptian who I met 1 year ago. I made the big move of giving up my job in the uk and leaving my friends and family for the man I love. I have lived in sharm for 1 year now and have to say I am convinced he is 100% genuine.. He treats me really well, I have never given him a penny and he would do anything for me.. I have been to Cairo and met his family a few times and they are all lovely.. My dilemma is I love him lots however I am struggling with a few things.. He gets very jealous if i talk to any men or want to do normal western things like go out with friends ( which is rare as I have very few!!) which makes me feel very isolated.. I see him every day and every night, he never leaves my side so I know he is not up to no good as neither am I.. I just miss normal interaction which makes me question my future and future of potential children... Maybe I was naive to the huge cultural and religious differences.. He makes comment to change my religion but doesn't push it.. He wants to marry in Cairo in a few months.. I am very undecided between love and my long term happiness.. Help and advice please :-)

melissa1984
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12/7/2012 10:13    
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Don't marry him. You have no idea how many rights you will be giving up and the embassy won't help you. Once you marry him, he owns you and the kids. You cannot leave the country without his permission. They are very jealous, why else do the women wear covers? Because the men don't want them to be seen. And yes you will be very lonely. These men have a tradition of wanting the women to stay in the house and focused only on them and once you marry him it will be far worse because you cannot just up and leave. Talk about loney and isolated. And how about your work....are you working because one person can never fill the void of community and needing to have stimulating relationships and work. I promise you that this will be the worst mistake you have ever made and everything is on the line. I went through this....this is a male dominated culture and owning your wife is part of the deal. Unless you are ok with being owned and isolated you will be miserable and
you cannot leave the country without his permission. The cultures are vastly different and cannot be rectified for most of us. Good luck. Do what is right for YOU and pay attention to the warning signs which will become far worse after you are married. Melissa

CasualCairo
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From: Egypt
12/8/2012 02:24    
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I think melissa1984 has gone a bit OTT in her response, but I tend to agree with her.
I think you have to make up your own mind. I have known a few foreign women that have married Egyptians and are happy, but what I kept thinking about while reading her response is the political situation we currently have in Egypt. If she had such a bad experience back under the Mubarak regime, consider how much worse it might be now under the Muslim Brotherhood or could be if they get the constitution they are working to get. Women and children will have fewer rights than they did under the old regime.
If it were me, I would use that as an excuse to hold off on getting married. There should be NO HURRY to marry, and if he can't understand your concerns on that front, he isn't the right guy for you. And if you aren't concerned about that, then you may as well convert to Islam, or you aren't mature enough to consider such a marriage.
If he won't allow you to go out with friends alone with out him now, it won't change, probably. It is more than him just being "jealous". Consider the preconceived ideas we Western women have about Arab-Muslim men. The same holds true of them having preconceived ideas about us. I think it may take more than a year of being together to completely dispell those ideas. Like melissa1984 is validating everything we've ever heard about the men, so are his friends probably validating everything about Western women to him - maybe not by saying anything, but by sleeping with the women on one night stands and playing the game. Sharm would be a difficult place to get away from that, I imagine. The whole place is so full of players....and Western women living up to our reputation too. How can you not be touched by it?

Good luck in making your decision, but keep in mind that if you choose to marry him, #1 - NEVER give him your passport and #2 it might be harder to change your mind a year down the road than you considered. I don't know how old you are, but I bet you have time to wait.

melissa1984
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12/8/2012 08:56    
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I agree with Casual
Cairo. This is not to say that so many of the Egyptians I have met are absolutely wonderful and the overall culture is embracing even of us Christians. In fact Egypt feels like home to me in so many ways, but I learned over many years that marrying an Egyptian is very different from dating one. Don't forget
either, that your life has many components and
a husband is only a piece to the puzzle of a balanced and full life. You know deep down what the answer is. Be honest with yourself and remember that life in a resort town, allows for a fantasy world that will drift away over time.

Becs1975
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12/9/2012 01:46    
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Thanks both Melissa and casual Cairo for your responses, they are both helpful and informative.
I actually agree completely with what you have said and know deep down what i have to do. I understand how things may change for the worse now the brotherhood are in power and for sure this is bad for me.. I have seen changes in my man in the past year( as you say this is not long) and for sure these will get worse and my fear was it would be a horrible life once I marry.
I have seen some marriages even here in sharm work.. With genuine kind Muslim people however i feel I am too independent and strong willed to give up all my life for love.. As Melissa said a husband is just 1 aspect which touched my heart.. I do love him lots but also love life which I feel I am missing out on.

I am 32 yrs old so no spring chicken but not over the hill(just yet) and my main worry was if I stick here another few years I will miss out on too much.

Western women of course are looked down upon and I feel that every day I live here and I feel I have lost some of my confidence already, I enjoy working but as you said mainly so I can fill some void I suppose..

It will be hard I know, I was married before in the uk for 6 years until he cheated but I'm not bitter it's just life but before this marriage was equal and the fact I never had doubts then but have massive ones now I suppose I answer my own question, but I felt compelled to get some honest in-biased views.. So I thank you.

My main concern was also future children as I didn't see much of s social aspect for them, or good schooling or healthcare, although my 1 friend here married for 5 yrs with Egyptian tried to convince me otherwise I just didn't see it.. I see my brother in the uk give his daughter so much ( not in terms of materialistic things).
Now I just have to be brave and go!!
Thanks again :-)

Becs1975
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12/9/2012 04:21    
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Hi boudica it seems we have similar stories you are very much in love but the country and cultures are worlds apart from our own. I see you are married so things there are difficult for you and even harder living in Alex which is why I could never live in Cairo! In sharm there are at least more westerners but most give us a bad name sleeping with every Tom dick and Harry!! And most are used and abused for sex and money!! I am in love and it will no doubt break my heart to leave him but I have decided I have to do this.. Life is just not enjoyable anymore and as Melissa told me in previous post this is only one aspect.. I used to have a good job, good money, lots of friends, ambition. I have travelled the world seen lots of amazing things.. But now my day to day life consists of staying in the house not having any social life., being leered at 24/7 by other men who clearly just think i am easy, being ripped off in supermarkets( even happens when we are together as they think i am just on holiday, so have money!!) the isolation you feel as all his friends Egyptian and of course family members when they are all speaking you sit there feeling lost.. As it's obvious not all the translation is given to me of the conversation... The love and romance swept me off my feet but the reality is. Big eye opener..

So please understand I am not slating Egyptians of course there are good and bad, and I believe mine is good but I cannot change his beliefs or culture, his strong opinion of what is right and wrong or how women indeed are seen here!! I often hear from him " I cam because I am a man" makes me angry!!

I am thankful I never married, and given the feedback and my gut feeling I won't.. Which now I know means I can't stay here... I can't waste my life if I am not to marry or have children with him.. I want more for myself and my future children... It's a hard decision but I have to be strong so wish me luck!! :-)

CasualCairo
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From: Egypt
12/9/2012 11:17    
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Thank you for your insight Becs. You have lived the romance and the nightmare it sounds like. Your nightmare is mild compared to what it could have been, but it's great to hear from someone that was smart enough NOT to get married and take it that far for what they misinterpreted as "real love" that would last forever. You tried it and can say it is not the right move for most. You need to be a really special person for it to work and even then it's good to live here a while and see if Egypt is right for you with or without a man involved. For me, the country itself was enough and I'm happy to live here, but have NO desire for the drama marriage to an Egyptian will bring into your life.

Becs1975
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12/9/2012 13:22    
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Thanks casual Cairo.. And your right my nightmare was no where near as bad as it could have been..

I recommend anyone thinking of marrying your "true love" live in Egypt over 6 months as the true colours sure start to show and then you can make your own informed decision as I have done.

I am smart and intelligent and have tried to make it work, but seemingly it's not enough for me. I would never get married so quickly in the uk so decided not to rush it here.. And luckily I didn't..

Please girls think very hard, for some you may be fine but give yourself time.

It really is not an easy life..

Thanks again :-)

Deshara0628
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12/12/2012 23:10    
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Hello, I'm new to this forum. I want true and honest opnions. I have met this Egyptian man online and he wants us to marry. I have 2 children from a previous relationship that ended a few years back. I'm a christian woman and he is islamic. He knows all this, my question is though, how hard is it to be accepted in the Egyptian culture as far as me already having 2 kids. I love him so much and he loves me. He knows that I have only been with the kids father and that I am different. I don't date different men or anything like that, though I'm obviously not a virgin, I consider myself a good woman enough for him. Any thoughts on this would be helpful, thanks.

melissa1984
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12/13/2012 09:07    
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if you want the truth, it is on this site? You hae no idea how many rights you would be giving up if you marry him? Egypt is a great place but not so much for women. The
way that you'd be living re standard of living is low. just because you love someone does not mean that you change your whole life, culture, etc. and then drag your kids into it. You need to step back, get more information and realize that egyptians marry at the drop of a hat and it is likely that you are entering
into a nightmare and taking your kids along for the ride, all in the name of love. Be smart and rethink this.

Deshara0628
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12/13/2012 17:26    
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I don't know if I would be willing to move with my two kids there because of the cultural differences but maybe he could come here. Thank you for responding by the way. I guess only time will tell if he would be willing to move here instead. I don't think I could take my kids away from their father....this is so complicated. I wish there was an easier way to make things easier because I truly love this man.

Becs1975
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12/13/2012 20:59    
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Deshara please read my post a few places up...
Life in Egypt is incredibly hard, I am 32 and would like children soon and this is one of the many reasons I don't wish to stay in Egypt.. In my opinion there is no future for them.
My bf was very keen to marry within weeks of meeting but I have held off and boy I am glad I did... He is still very sweet and romantic but eventually he will try to chance your religion, clothes, and stop you socialising.. It all happens gradually.. The culture differences are huge you have no idea... And even if he came to england he is still Muslim so would bring his very very strong beliefs and when your married things will change even more!!
No matter what they tell you in the beginning eventually things start to change and maybe you don't realise.

I agree it is hard, I still love him and scared I am throwing away my true love, but I know deep down if I marry I will give up all my indepence and so many values and believe me life here is lonely and women are less valued that is a fact..
Please think seriously.. And I am just talking about cultural differences here never mind the thousands of scams I see with my own eyes of men getting women to get married so they can leave Egypt to then only leave when the visa is approved.. The most loved up sincere men do a runner with money etc.. I am not saying this is yr case as I don't know the story but believe me living and working here is not all people think it is.. For sure if I had children I would want to provide the best I could and believe me that's not here for most people!!
I wish you luck and feel free to ask anything :-) I am not miss experienced but have lived the romantic love story and now sorting stuff to leave after 1 year living in Egypt.. But believe me if I was married it would be almost impossible to leave...!!!!!

CasualCairo
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From: Egypt
12/14/2012 05:14    
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Bottom line - Don't marry someone you only know over the Internet and know NOTHING about his culture. He will say anything to get what he wants....especially these days post revolution. If you think you are in love, come and live here for a minimum of a year to see how things go and how well you like the place.
To say "maybe he will be willing to move here (ie UK or USA)" is rediculous! I'm sorry to be so harsh, but OF COURSE he is willing to move there. That is why he is courting you! The thing neither of you get is that the gov't of the USA or the UK is NOT going to make it easy for you to get him there. There are lines of women just like you standing outside the Embassies crying their eyes out, wondering why the embassy people are so mean and won't let their boyfriend (fiance or even husband) just go to their country with them. Please come spend some time watching all these women with their boyfriends and you will see why the governments aren't letting them all go. In the end, you should be prepared to live in Egypt. Egypt is going to be more open to letting you live here than your country is going to be to letting him go live there.... and that might change too with the current government. Hope not, but it could happen. Best to wait and see what is going to happen.
Sorry to break your heart on this subject but it has to be said.
SORRY!

CasualCairo
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From: Egypt
12/14/2012 05:24    
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Further Deshara - DO NOT drag your kids in on this. They and their father do not deserve that. If you want to test the waters here and see if this thing works, you do it FOR YOU, and you leave the kids out of it. If it doesn't work (and you can tell from the responses here that the odds are against you) then there is NO reason why the kids should have been drug over here and had their lives any further disrupted than they already are by the initial divorce. I hope their father is willing to take them while you try this for yourself, if you must. If not, then please put the children first and your need/desires/whatever for a boyfriend/husband/man in your life second. You can take care of that 20 years from now when the kids are grown up, if a better solution for you doesn't come up at home sometime.
Again, sorry to be so harsh, but I've seen mothers do this to their kids over the years I've lived here and it ALWAYS ends up bad. I have yet to find one story where a mother with her children moved to Egypt from a western country to marry some Egyptian and things worked out well. IF anyone knows even one story where the couple has been together (at least) 5 years, please share it.

yazz1972
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12/14/2012 08:44    
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update. i first posted on here 10th nov 2011. so mahmoud and i are still going strong. miss him alot. went back to see him in nov 2012. But havnt done the visitors visa for him yet. he says hes not ready to come to london, even for a holiday! his sister is getting married in march 2013 and then he said he will be free to come. hes still got alot of worries and responsibilities for his family. but mabey its a good sign that he dosnt want to rush over here.... but boy, are all egyptian men moody!! he can be a right moody sod, but when i give it back to him, he appologises. apart from that, and the fact that he dosnt like my cooking! im still in love and all is cool. x

melissa1984
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12/14/2012 09:38    
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Thanks for your honesty CC. I wrote a similar emal but cannot emphasize enough what a horrible move it would be. You have no idea what a nightmare you'd be putting them through not to mention yourself. I don't even think the courts would allow it if your husband disputed it.

Dd100
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2/24/2013 10:16    
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I'm like u all! In the same situation with an egyptain man! He is everything I have ever wanted! But ask me if I trust him and the answer would be no! My heart is saying dont judge him as other bad egyptian men but its hard no to when u hear so much bad stories! Help

yazz1972
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2/25/2013 08:43    
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so its been about a year and 4 months since i first posted on this site.In feb 2012 mahmoud and i did the orfi marraige on valentines day. so heres my update. all is well. i still visit 3 times a year. love and trust is still there. ive been getting to know his good points and bad points and moodiness is one of his BAD points. otherwise i still feel hes the one for me but im happy at the moment with the way things are. havnt done a visit visa for him yet as hes always changing jobs or theres some problem so its no point doing the visa until we know we have everything ready. ive no intentions of living in egypt. and i do miss him when i have to come back home, but luckily im too busy to let it get to me too much. hope you are all ok and look forward to hearing more GOOD stories from you.

yazz1972
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2/25/2013 08:44    
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so its been about a year and 4 months since i first posted on this site.In feb 2012 mahmoud and i did the orfi marraige on valentines day. so heres my update. all is well. i still visit 3 times a year. love and trust is still there. ive been getting to know his good points and bad points and moodiness is one of his BAD points. otherwise i still feel hes the one for me but im happy at the moment with the way things are. havnt done a visit visa for him yet as hes always changing jobs or theres some problem so its no point doing the visa until we know we have everything ready. ive no intentions of living in egypt. and i do miss him when i have to come back home, but luckily im too busy to let it get to me too much. hope you are all ok and look forward to hearing more GOOD stories from you.

lionking2013
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2/26/2013 15:12    
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Hello!

I am an Egyptian/American, and by accident came across this forum. Very interesting views! Of course, everyone has a unique experience and prospective on relationships; not to mention life itself. However, one thing remains constant. That is the adjustment needed to fit within a culture different from your own, especially when being in a different culture involves a personal/intimate relationship with someone else. Believe me, I know all about it. If you cannot adjust and understand how to fit in a different culture (for example, learning the language, traditions, habits etc.), and feel intimidated by major changes, just stay at home where you can be safe around all the familiar things to which you have been accustomed. Just go to Egypt to visit and leave in peace.

Irma
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2/27/2013 11:42    
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lionking2013, do you think that person has to skip her (?) own culture / history/ personality?

lionking2013
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2/27/2013 12:24    
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Not at all !! All I meant to say is to simply be able to expand and go beyond one's own cultural and historical boundaries ( provided, of course, one has the desire and ability to do so). As to personalities, people are who they are. One could have a personality different from his/her own brother or sister, or may be the neighbor next door. Many couples have to compromise to get along to overcome their conflicting personalities.

Simply, all I intended to say is to be open minded about other cultures and, in doing so, you would be able to understand such a culture and have the awareness you need to (a) protect yourself and (b) fit in such a culture if you desire to do so. Sorry if I sounded harsh in my previous post. Best!

melissa1984
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2/27/2013 13:34    
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And you say it so eloquenly and are on the money, from my point of you.....not harsh at all. Melissa

lionking2013
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2/27/2013 15:03    
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Thanks, Melissa! I wish you and your Egyptian friend the best! Of course, like in any relationship, it is only wise to assess your situation carefully with whomever you intend to have a commitment. Leave your options open for contingencies. Alf Mabrook in advance! :-) Magdy

scooby69
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3/23/2013 12:32    
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Hi,

I am currently researching for ITV's THIS MORNING and am looking for English woman to share their experiences of relationships with Egyptian men. Please post on here and I will get in touch.
Best
Tom

melissa1984
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3/23/2013 18:54    
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you can email me at elissabeam@yahoo.com

lionking2013
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3/25/2013 08:55    
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I am a little confused about the specificity and subjectivity of the subject about English Women married to, or having relationships with, Egyptian Men! Why point out the problems relating only to these two nationalities? Why not chose a subject about Marriage or Relationships of English women to foreigners (in general)? Are you telling us that cultural differences or the exploitation of certain women who put themselves in situations leading to their own exploitation (either intentionally or unintentionally) does not exist else where, even within the U.K. itself? Come on!!! Obviously, if such women found men so ideals in their own country they would not have sought or tempted to seek love/relationships else where.

I am an Egyptian male and my wife is an American. We have been married for over 26 years now, and have 3 beautiful grown up children. Over the years, we have had good and bad days like many married couples. We have learned over the years to compromise to be able to get along, and we still love and need each other. I believe my wife thinks of me as a good man and a good husband. There are many good people in Egypt (men and women)! Of course, there are also others who are not so good. Using a generalization to cast "Egyptian Men" in a bad light based on the experience of a few women, is neither fair nor objective. Having said that, I am now reminded that objectivity on TV shows, interested in making huge profits for their owners through scandals and provocations, may not sell as much!!

There will always be people in any society who would not hesitate in taking advantage of others to serve their own interest. In this regard, and historically speaking, I am reminded that GB and many of its people, as a vivid example, have exploited the whole world and its resources for centuries, including countries, such as Egypt!! Does this make me think that ALL Brits are thieves? The answer is no. I am sure many Brits are nice and decent people who believe in fairness, freedom, hard work and decency.

So, my question here is why do you feel the need to generalize subjective views about Egyptian men or any other nationalities (e.g., Greeks, Italians, Spanish, Mexicans, Russians, Irish, British, etc.)?

Joabdalla
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3/25/2013 11:39    
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Totally agree lion King :-)

lionking2013
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3/28/2013 08:27    
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Joabdalla, I hope all is well. I totally agree with your agreement with me, as well! :-)

I see that Melissa1984 has very strong views on the subject. I could be confusing her with someone else, but if I recall correctly, she had posted messages previously that no longer appear on this forum. I believe she was excited and optimistic about a marriage prospect with an Egyptian. However, based on her recent views, one could tell things didn't go well.

I wonder whether she is already on TV and Famous by now!! Anyway, I wish her and the good people on this Forum well. .

Irma
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3/29/2013 09:55    
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it is only about Egyptian men becouse this is a Egypt Expat Forum

lionking2013
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3/29/2013 11:49    
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True! I may have lost sight of this fact! However, my intention is simply to point out the fact that this is a universal issue, and limiting it to problems with Egyptian Men only, as they pertain to British women only, appears to be subjective. I am also not impressed when certain people impose their views on others, as if their views are simply written in stone and their bad experiences are certain to happen to someone else. Of course every person should be careful when getting involved in any culture different from his/her own. However, assuming that a bad experience of someone is doomed to happen to someone else is not always a good approach to life.

Irma
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3/30/2013 03:15    
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Lionking2013, i have been looking for websites in my own country ( we also have so called "loverboys". most of the are not authentic Dutch and this is international
http://www.beznessalert.com/eng/index.html

Margo2
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3/30/2013 04:18    
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There are woman from all over the world how get scamed by this Boys.
Right now I'm trying to explain a woman, that she will be hustled but it is against unfortunately she don't want to hear it. She is in love.

What else can you do? I have previously asked for stories on this site, so that i can make a book off all the stories and than maybe more women can be warned!

Send your story to me at hettievansteenis@gmail.com

Margo2
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3/30/2013 06:14    
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I know that, thats what i meand whit my message. The egyptian man and europen woman.

lionking2013
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3/30/2013 21:27    
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I understand that there are some Egyptian men, especially those involved in the tourism industry, who may fit the description of lover boys. However, these are not the typical Egyptian males. There are many good, honest, kind and decent men in Egypt. As a male, I had many good friends that were like brothers to me, and I would not have hesitated accepting any of them as a husband for any of my sisters. I think the issue here involves the human nature. Sometimes we gravitate towards things that are not good for us. For example, some people love eating too much chocolate, even though they know it is not good for them and makes them gain weight. Right?! :-) Similarly, some women are attracted to bad men. People are unique and each has or would like to have unique experiences that match his/her own personality. My advice to anyone interested in a good relationship is to go after the substance of a person; not just the good looks. Also, trust, but verify! :-)

QueenNeffertiti
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4/26/2013 12:54    
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Salams sister....just one word of advice ...do not look for men outside your own country..there are plenty of men willing to marry you,,one bad expierence with an Egyptian man was all to loose all i had...property is very apealing to them and the most terrible thing these men plan over years ahead..you might be married 15 years andd thinking your marriage works till you will awake and realise it was all a fraud ...as i said these men are doing all in secret never openly and they plan...they have lots of patience when they know the bait is worthwhile

Joabdalla
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4/29/2013 14:09    
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Queen Neffertti that's a very stereotypical statement !!!

I could say the same about My Ex Husband ... English born and bred .

I wouldn't say this is an Egyptian Men problem it's a human one and impacts on both sexes of humans regardless of race or creed .

karimaN
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5/8/2013 16:17    
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Salyam salyam to all!
this man [URL=http://plokna.ru/][IMG]http://radikal.ua/data/upload/49112/4fa6c/cbe6f5bfe1.jpg[/IMG][/URL] deceived two englishwoman. warning!!

karimaN
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5/8/2013 16:18    
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worning!!! deceive man
[URL=http://plokna.ru/][IMG]http://radikal.ua/data/upload/49112/4fa6c/cbe6f5bfe1.jpg[/IMG][/URL]

boudica
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5/10/2013 05:09    
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If western women are so gullible and easily fooled then they deserve what they get. Egyptian men are great. End of story.

Irma
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5/10/2013 12:05    
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well thats a stupid end of story

marcynabdou
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6/14/2013 00:52    
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i disagree with the other comment i married my husband in march going back in august he is so loving caring and kind and so is his whole family.i also have 4 kids he knows that and so does his family. i also have alot of tattoos and 2 peircingsno one cares not that i go flashing them tho lol and my husband never been with anyone before me so not all marry at the drop of a hat lol..we are deeply in love have been since a month after we met now its going on 7 months yes things r different living there than the us but embrace it and im sure they will embrace u :) trust your heart good luck

CasualCairo
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From: Egypt
6/14/2013 11:15    
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Marcy - I think it is very sweet that you and Abdou are still happy together, but PLEASE write to us in 7 years, not 7 months and tell us what you think then.

You really are still WAY too new to it to be very objective. In fact you say you married in March and are going "back" in August. Does that mean you aren't even with him now? If that is true, then you really need to get some time under your belt with the guy before making comments. Wait until you are living with them and dealing with their feelings about you, you kids, your tats, piercings and everything every day. They might remain the way you say they have been about that stuff, but there is an equal chance that you will be real surprised when push comes to shove and you're in the house with them.

Also, is that 7 months time that you've known each other - 7 months of being in the same city or mostly 7 months of emailing and Skyping and missing each other. REALLY REALLY different if you don't know that yet. I hope he is one in a million, expecially for those 4 kids of yours.

lionking2013
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6/14/2013 12:21    
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I wonder what everyone finds out about his/her partner after 7 years in a relationship, regardless of where or with whome a person has the relationship. I am sure most people cannot predict that. I agree that 7 months are early to judge a relationship. However, any relationship has to start somehow. As to the Tatoo, it is actually not that uncommon in Egypt. In fact, if you are familiar with the Egyptian culture, specificially in upper Egypt, you would know that many females have tatoos on their hands, arms, legs or foreheads (the part of the face above the eyebrows, below the hairline and between the temples). Occasionally, ladies over there wear gold rings on the side of the nose, as well. So, I don't think a Tatoo, in and of itself, would be a disqualifier for a successful relationship! :-) I hope things will work out for you. We all have the right to pursue happiness any where and any time.

marcynabdou
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6/14/2013 14:08    
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Yes its been 7 months since we known eachother its like we have known eachother for years since we were kidshe says lol and trust me I will write in 7 years cuz I know we r right for eachother...I was married to another man for almost 19 years from yemen he raised my two oldest and we have two more...totally different men I must say thought I kbew what love was then but he was just a cheating control freak that jus wanted to keep me unhappy...reason not with abdou now is I had financial reason among personal to come back also to start his visaI would have stayed longer if not..and we did live together met his whole fam they loved me intsantly I was so releived...never felt so much love in such a short time...my kids r older so that is not a problem time for mama to really be happy...I guess when u know u know :)

melissa1984
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6/14/2013 14:14    
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Marcy, good luck to you. I too could not understand your timeline. You have been in Egypt 7 months and then married and are going home for 2 months and then will bring your 4 kids back with you? Will your 4 kids live in Egypt and go to school there too, I guess. Are they comfortable with such a huge change not to mention being away from their father and grandparents.
Just curious because as CC infers, changing your own life is purely your choice but
changing a whole family's life is quite another. Again, just could not tell from your post.

My mother left America at 4 and grew up in Aruba. She had both parents though, but it was a great experience. The language spoken in Aruba is mostly English though, so that helped her.

I like CC will be interested to hear back from you in a year or so and also curious as to the impact of the revolution on life in Egypt. Good luck.

marcynabdou
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6/14/2013 14:15    
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Well thank u and yes they do have to start some where and I never saw one tattoo over there while I was there or a peircing...and trust me no one has tattoos like me over there lol but his whole fam accept me for me and that's all that matters :) I love abdou he is the best thing that happened to me besides my children..god willing I can give my husband 2 lol but if not he say he don't care all he been waiting for his whole life is a caring loving woman like me...thanks again for the words of encouragement god knows I had my own fam n friends to deal with and they now know they were wrong :)

marcynabdou
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6/14/2013 14:23    
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Sorry let me get it a lil better lol we met in dec. Went from march til april going back in august til december. And as for my kids they are grown they will not begoing with me and as soon as visa goes thru my husband will be here with me...and as for the revolution I hope it gets better the people deserve it all they want to do is live and work like anybody else...thank for the good luck :)

marcynabdou
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6/14/2013 14:38    
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Not very good at these forums my husband is tho feel free to add me on facebook friends name is marcy ellasy :)

marcynabdou
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6/14/2013 14:39    
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Good luck sounds like u found a great man like I did..congrats friend

marcynabdou
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6/14/2013 14:52    
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I disagree my hubby doesn't want to come to usa he will if he has to jus like I will move to egypt if I have to cuz really we jus want to start our life but we both know egypt is in a bad place right now...not all men are scams and in any realtionship there is a fight to win this is life and if u don't fight for it u will lose

marcynabdou
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6/16/2013 14:12    
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Wow u can't even hold hands or be alone wtf lol sorry that is aweful.my husbands family is so not like that I feel sorry for u but it is you and your husbands life not theirs they need to understand that...my husbands family loves me so much hugs n kisses all the time .very loving family when we had our celebration for our wedding I felt like a queen so many pics of us kiss n hug dance I will never forget it...never felt so much love and I was married before...so my take on this is your husband needs to stand up for u and himself if he really loves u cuz my husband would never let anything or anyone hurt me not even family at first he didn't even want me to meet his mom n dad jus sisters cuz he didn't want them to judge us well guess what they didn't go for that they wanted to meet me and I couldn't be happier they are amazing cute couple that have raised 8 wonderful kids :) good luck to you u can have a happy life but u have to fight for it :)

CasualCairo
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From: Egypt
6/16/2013 14:19    
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Marcy - Where will you live with Ahmed when you come to Egypt? Do you have a flat picked out somewhere yet? Where?

marcynabdou
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6/16/2013 14:20    
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Not all of them are like this lol my husband says he's my slave lo and all men r jealous jus more so middle easter men it the way they were raised and not all women cover up my husband give me a choice if i want to or not..my story is amazing I hope urs can be the same

CasualCairo
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From: Egypt
6/16/2013 14:24    
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Where are you going to live when you come back to Egypt? Do you have a flat picked out yet? Where is it?

marcynabdou
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6/16/2013 14:39    
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Abdou they call him that for short his real name abdelhakim :) but in alex we stay in mammorra last time I think that where we will stay again my husband say it much safer and quieter I loved it was awesome

marcynabdou
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6/16/2013 14:40    
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Alex :)

CasualCairo
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From: Egypt
6/17/2013 01:39    
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Sorry about the repeat question. I tried to delete the second one. Somehow between my computer, and us posting at nearly the same time, my first question didn't show up to me before you posted again, so I thought it had not been accepted - then I wrote the other one and then of course they both showed up. Oh well.

So what does Abdou do? What's his job? Will you work when you come? I do hear on FB of some foreign women married to Egyptians that teach up there.

marcynabdou
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6/17/2013 02:05    
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He's the teacher I am the student lol jus kiddin he is a mechanical engineer got his bachlors so proud of him was in the army very smart on computers to no work for me there I'm going to see my husband :) his parents very sick right now I pray they don't pass I don't know if he can handle it he already miss me so don't know how he would handle that n I can't go til august to be there for him so I jus pray they get well

marcynabdou
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6/17/2013 02:05    
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He's the teacher I am the student lol jus kiddin he is a mechanical engineer got his bachlors so proud of him was in the army very smart on computers to no work for me there I'm going to see my husband :) his parents very sick right now I pray they don't pass I don't know if he can handle it he already miss me so don't know how he would handle that n I can't go til august to be there for him so I jus pray they get well

melissa1984
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6/17/2013 17:29    
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Just remember new love creates hormones that resemble heroine so go slow and follow that small quiet voice that is where wisdom resides!

lionking2013
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6/17/2013 18:35    
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Glad you are back, Melissa1984! We missed your words of Wisdom.

marcynabdou
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6/18/2013 00:53    
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Lol that hilarious but thanks for the advice melissa

Mooneyes
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8/26/2013 01:25    
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When I met Mohammed a year ago I kept reading stories of Egyptian men. 99% were bad stories. I never talked to him with the hope of a relationship, it started off as a friendship and slowly built to love.

Those 99% bad stories, I figured were because people like to complain and be heard when something is bad, rarely when something is good.

Mohammed was educated, , worked in the medical field. His entire family was also educated with respected careers. They owned their own home (not an apartment) that was beautifully decorated. His parents very wonderful, open minded people.


He would spend hours with me on skype and on the phone calling and texting with me. We talked about everything from religion, to politics, to our personal dreams/hopes of the future, our careers (both in the medical field), our families, and about our own future together.

He had me meet his friends on skype, his entire family including aunts, cousins, etc. He wanted to meet my family also, and then he suggested our families meet.

They invited me to come to Egypt to stay with them so I could meet everyone in person. I stayed in their house, I ate meals with them, traveled around to meet everyone. There were days Mohammed would have to work and I stayed home with his mom and brothers and I had so much fun with them.

I went back home more in love then I had ever been. Not just with him but his entire family. Those 99% stories were wrong, the egyptians were wonderful people, I had the man of my dreams who treated me so perfect, who constantly told me he loved me.

and then....

I find out I was not the only girl he had. Not one, not two, not three, but 4 girls at least that I found out he was talking to at the same time as me. Telling him the same words he would tell me, using the words I would tell him on these girls, I also found out about many past girls that stopped communicating with him. All the same words, the words he used to win my heart. My Mohammed, this educated, religious, sensitive guy who won my heart, was no longer the man I knew.

4 girls was the amount I found out about. I had a chance to contact each one of them about their relationship, how long it had been going on for, etc. 4 girls... 4 that I knew about and I was the only one stupid enough to go meet him! to have plans to marry him.

He never once asked me for money, in fact he offered to buy my ticket to come see him (although he said he knew i would say no because I am very independent).

We only started talking about sex after months of talking and when we both finally declared we loved each other. He was a virgin and was proud of it, it meant everything to him to keep his virginity until he was married.....

All these things these 99% stories warn us about he did not do.

He had also asked me to live in Egypt many times.

I want to tell my story because I believed him, I was getting ready to change my life to be with him forever, change my life in a big way.

Each girl I talked to told me the same thing that they believed him because his words felt so true.

He had asked each one of them about visa to their countries, he never really asked me about a visa to America but we had talked about getting married. Each one of them he invited to Egypt, he couldnt wait to marry them, to spend his life with them and to give them his virginity.

It's taking me a long time to get over him. I mourn for the future we had planned for the man I thought he was. He touched my heart and my mind in a way no one had ever touched before.... and to realize it was all pretend killed me.

I'm not saying all egyptian men are like him or like the other 99% horror stories you read about but I want to caution that even when you go with caution, when everything looks safe sometimes it is not.

I also read a lot that these stories are about older women. I'm young, I'm educated, I'm the "typical all american" blonde hair, blue eye, 5'6', 115lbs girl who loves fashion and sports, who loves to read, travel, likes politics, different cultures, etc etc. I get asked out a lot here, but he was the one who started off as a friendship and i felt I had such a deep connection with, i wasn't with him because I couldnt find love in my own country.

Irma
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8/26/2013 08:16    
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thanx for your open story, i am sorry you also had a bad experience. i hope you will find another good man! Trustfull. Can you tell your story here please? http://beznessalert.com/

melissa1984
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8/26/2013 11:18    
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Thank you for being brave enough to tell your story. Also let me tell you that the idea that most women who fall for an Egyptian man "can't find love in their own country" or are much older and are basically lonely losers is a myth. In my own case I was dating in my own country, very successful law career, but just found Hamdy to be more interestingin every way. What I found so astounding about your story is that his whole family went along with it and that you stayed with them. They did know, right? Whatever the case, you will look back on this and be so glad you did not marry him. May your heart heal quickly, learn the lessons and find a healthy relationship based on honesty and respect.

trixibelle
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8/27/2013 15:15    
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I think personally all this generalization of Egyptian men is a little silly.. If you dont take chances in life you wont learn,, The amount of blogs I have read on this I mean really it wouldn't matter where they are from for instance and ex of mine had so many women on the go that one he ended up with, i kicked him out when i found out but his new girlfriend assumed he lived on his own and had been dating 2 months before i found out. So in all honesty whats the difference, and very rare do I read about women who have been fleeced.. but on the other hand my ex also stole from me but I havent written a blog on 'don't trust English men' it all runs on the same principle..

Everyone has a right to live in any other country and what people have to also be aware it doesnt always mean visa neither there are many ways to obtain some permanency

yes I met and Egyptian but I am not going to generalize him.as he did something any man would have done and have so many believing the same thing but if he picks the one he wants he will stop the others. Im sorry but even us women have done it to make sure we have picked right,, Now I did end it with him and still talking to see what happens now and im not even going to disclose info because people will find fault, rather then see the bigger picture.

live and learn

melissa1984
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8/27/2013 18:26    
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silly, gee that is helpful. I am glad folks have shared THEIR EXPERIENCES HONESTLY, and if I choose to generalize then that is on me.

trixibelle
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8/28/2013 06:49    
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Ok its people like you that give others a bad name, Sorry but it is.... any women scorned or caught in a love trap will let others know.. thats why they are scorned they are hurt.... Maybe you should read all sites and see what they all say they are really no different.. Yes ok you get the ones that really are caught so yes feel free to express but that is how labels are made.......more fool those who have holiday romances too..... all men are pigs as are women its whether you are compatible to each other etc... live with it and deal with it.. like I said if I wrote about my ex you would see how no different it was to a n Egyptian, Moroccan, Turk, etc.....

Irma
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8/28/2013 15:50    
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in the touristic places this is Business, thats the point ( some other countries too)

melissa1984
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8/28/2013 16:21    
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yea the tourist areas more so for sure but that young woman from the USA was dealing with a well educated guy/family from Cairo!

melissa1984
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8/28/2013 16:22    
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yea the tourist areas more so for sure but that young woman from the USA was dealing with a well educated guy/family from Cairo!

Chelsealk92
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8/31/2013 15:39    
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Hello ladies and gents I have been reading all your stories and can not help but register and ask u all if u think I'm crazy. I went away to Egypt this summer for my 21st birthday and had an amazing time. I met a lovely man and he's amazing in every way and like many of you said he has never asked me for money or mentioned money all he ever says is I want to look after you habiby and make you a queen I have been back in the uk for just 3 weeks now. We speak every day on the phone and on Skype he has told his whole family about me and I have met 2 of his nephews and have spoke. To his sister over the phone. I miss him like crazy even tho i was only with him for a week He has an amazing family and wants us to marry in 2014 I'm excited but also at the same time very nervous about moving my whole life to Egypt. Help me ladies am I crazy? Or just crazy in love! Lol nothing happened between us other than going for dinner long talks and massages as he is a masseuse and this is how I met him. He never gives me the impression that he wants anything from me apart from to love me he's a lovely guy and has a great family. So people am I crazy?

melissa1984
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8/31/2013 16:45    
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You know the answer. It all sounds so romantic. A country in the midst of revolution a guy who knows how to say all that we want to hear. My guy said I want to take care of you habibi too. I mean take a good look at Egypt. There is a reason so many young folks want to leave and believe me you will want to leave too and that is when he begs you to take him along. Is your life so cheap that you can just give it over to a guy you have known a week? Go to therapy, not to Egypt. You deserve better than a hard life in Egypt where females are third class citizens. Do you want your daughters to be raised in a country where women are not equal? Do you want to live in a country where you don't speak the language? Do you want to live in a country where you can't get a job or have girlfriends or the basic comforts of home like a great English speaking movie in a nice theatre? Not to mention no alcohol or a social life that resembles anything western.
Given the civil unrest, that alone should keep you home.
The marriage thing, they all start talking about that right away. Don't think you are special, you are simply prey in a big net. If you have to learn the hard way, go, otherwise wake up and smell the roses.

CasualCairo
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From: Egypt
8/31/2013 17:17    
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Sounds like she caught a bit of the MMID virus while she was in Egypt. MMID? (My Mohamed Is Different) Just heard that the other day from some women living in Egypt and thought it is pretty difinitive of what happens here.

On the other hand, living in Cairo isn't nearly as AWFUL as Melissa makes it sound like.
1 - Western women have the rights anyone else has - certainly not 3rd class citizens
2 - You could learn the language if you wanted to
3 - You can get a job if you have skills and a College degree. Even without that, if you are creative you can make yourself a job.
4 - We have English speaking movies. About 4 wks ago I went to see Now You See Me. It was new in the states, it was out here too. Go to www.yalabina.com to see what movies are at which theaters.
5 - What do you mean NO ALCOHOL? We have home delivery of alcohol. Google Drinkies or Cheers. They both deliver all the booze made here in Egypt. Plenty to keep most of us Expats happy.
And there are social clubs you can join to know other foreign friends.

What I think Melissa is really trying to say is WAIT and find out if you even know this guy. All too often women get themselves mixed up with Egyptian guys they really don't know very well and way too soon the romantic bubble is burst and they are living in a place that is not what they thought was in the bargain at all.
Just because all of those things are here in Egypt to enjoy, does not mean your husband or his family will accept that you want to partake in any of that.
You have 900 things to talk to your new friend about before you even consider marriage, and if it were me (and it was 16 yrs ago) you really should gather up all the money you think it would take to live in Egypt in the manner you want to become accoustomed and come live here for no less than 2 years NOT married to the man and see what he and his life really is all about.

Besides this - seriously - are you ready to be the wife of a masseure? I mean really? In Egypt that is not exactly a highly respected job. You might want to find out what he plans to be when he grows up.
If he is a Physical Therapist or some one in the Medical field and doing massage on the side, that is one thing, but to be one of the massage guys in a hotel or on a NIle cruise is not considered very respectable. I understand in the current economy lots of people are taking jobs they wouldn't normally do and if this is the case, then you should find out what he really hopes to do to support you and take care of you the way he thinks he can.
9 out of 10 times it's just talk and there are even times when it turns out there are other foreign women involved with the same guy or he is already married. Maybe your guy is the 1 out of 10, but I'll say if you met him in the tourist business your odds go down more. Sorry.
Hope it works out for you if you want it to in the end, but another thing to tell you is DO NOT go crying to the US EMBASSY that they are supposed to let you bring your fiance to America. They see 100's of women in the same boat every month and I can assure you they go behind their closed doors and laugh at the multitudes that come in thinking they can bring an Egyptian man home to America with them. If he is qualified to immigrate, he needs to do that on his own. Being your fiance is NOT going to get him the Golden Ticket. Again, sorry.

Sorry to be so Harsh. On occasion these things work out, but unfortunately, not too often.

Chelsealk92
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8/31/2013 17:40    
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I must say I am loving the replies I am getting on here. Melissa I do speak the language, as for the country being in a revolution this does not bother me all countries have their problems and I believe this state of emergency will be over by the time I am ready to go to Egypt. I don't plan to go back untill 2014 January February times and even tho he says he wants to marry me I have said I will only go in january for 6 months to see how I like life so I'm not saying I will go out there marry and become a good Egyptian housewife and walk 3 steps behind my husband. He can not leave Egypt as he has not done his national service and he has no desire to come to England. Plus if I wanted to leave there's nothing stopping me getting on a plane and coming home. In regards to drinking that comment I find hilarious as I found plenty to drink while I was in Egypt and he is well aware of how western I am I have a number of tattoos and piercings so I'm pretty sure he's aware what I am like especially after spending my 21st bday with me drinking cocktails (me drinking that is not him) he is a modern Muslim and does not expect me to change my faith or how I am. I fully understand your views because they are all valid points that have crossed my own mind. An ur right no man is different but this is why I want to take the time to find out just what he's really about meet his family ect no way would I fly out n marry him straight away I soldo have a job waiting for me and friends living out there too maybe that's why it does not seem to outrageous for me. Thank u for ur opinion it's much appreciated n I'm loving the tough love lol

Chelsealk92
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8/31/2013 18:03    
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Casual Cairo thank you for ur semi support lol. I know that living in Egypt isn't as bad as some people think. And I know ill have rights and tht I can drink see English movies and make friends. I already speak Arabic, have friends in Egypt from England and other places I also have a job waiting for me in February and as for my Man he is not jus a messuce at the hotels e also owns his own spa and beauty shop in more than one place in Egypt so I know that beauty and massage is his future he makes good money has his own home car etc and I do not live in the states so I don't think it's a green card he is after lol I live in the uk and he has no desire to be in England and he hasn't done national service so he can not leave Egypt he is 30 well established and comes from a good family. His family and he knows I am a western girl that likes to have fun I have tattoos and piercings they do not seem to have a problem with me or my way of life they have no issue with my faith either I am catholic and they do not expect me to change my faith or myself which I think is a big thing considering he is the only son of 4 children they are happy for us to be together and can not wait for me to come and meet them I completely agree that we have a lot more to talk about and learn about one another and this is why I want to go for 6 months live life with him and see how we go and how I like life there I have also come home to earn more money and save in order I be able to hold myself up and not rely on him for everything I also have work waiting for me as I am a teacher in the uk also a beautician so work will not be hard to find maybe at this current time yes but I believe the evolution will come to an end and all Egyptians will be able to live life as before hopefully better than before and he makes good money from his businesses he has many talents and works hard. I am not ready to marry him immidietly no but I would be ready to be his wife and live life for the both of us in Egypt if we do work out and stay strong. Thanks again and no worries for ring harsh tough love is the key lol

JessicaRafter
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8/31/2013 19:19    
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I have been reading all this s... for far to long and cant ignore it now.

First off let me tell you my experience.

I have knownmy husband since we were like kids...met online through irc chat for sega dreamcast in 2001. We both were 16. We would talk everyday and over the years we spoke even when he went to saudi and anyone that is familar with the arab culture knows a girl just does not call a the boys house. His parents were ok with this but I did speak on several ocations to his mom and his brothers for years so his whole family knew who I was way before I met him in 2009...

His family were loveing caring and above everything openminded. He never asked me for money or to help leave egypt. There are some great guys there! True it is tho that itf you meet a guy in the tourism feild most likely he is there other than work...ie visa hunter. I lived in egypt for 2 years be4 I came back to the states. He never wanted to leave but the revolution made this too difficult to stay hence y we left.

You can a job in just about anything you want with a BS. Without a BS its harder but knowing english you can goto any school and teach conversational english and you will have the students sign up because you are a foreigner...
You get into the historical sites for like nothing if you are a legal resident or married to an egyptian you pay what they pay...just bring a copy of the marriage papers...if you see something you want and it costs too much to import it you can get it made...english movies are no problem...most theaters in the bigger cities will have the same showing in the regular english without subs...or they keep the movies as they are and cut out the nudies...and just have arabic subs...either way its not much different excite if your a girl you should never leave the house in shorts and a tank top and if you do go with a scarf around your neck atleast. Men will try to ask you for marriage right on the street and you just politly say no thank you and continue on your way.
If you truely like the guy you should just go and live there for a time become completely self sufficient and then if he is still into you make then you decide. Dont take the advice of someone who doesnt know about this place...besides you can buy liquor and beer and have it delivered or go to bars...and yes they do have bars!

JessicaRafter
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8/31/2013 19:20    
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I have been reading all this s... for far to long and cant ignore it now.

First off let me tell you my experience.

I have knownmy husband since we were like kids...met online through irc chat for sega dreamcast in 2001. We both were 16. We would talk everyday and over the years we spoke even when he went to saudi and anyone that is familar with the arab culture knows a girl just does not call a the boys house. His parents were ok with this but I did speak on several ocations to his mom and his brothers for years so his whole family knew who I was way before I met him in 2009...

His family were loveing caring and above everything openminded. He never asked me for money or to help leave egypt. There are some great guys there! True it is tho that itf you meet a guy in the tourism feild most likely he is there other than work...ie visa hunter. I lived in egypt for 2 years be4 I came back to the states. He never wanted to leave but the revolution made this too difficult to stay hence y we left.

You can a job in just about anything you want with a BS. Without a BS its harder but knowing english you can goto any school and teach conversational english and you will have the students sign up because you are a foreigner...
You get into the historical sites for like nothing if you are a legal resident or married to an egyptian you pay what they pay...just bring a copy of the marriage papers...if you see something you want and it costs too much to import it you can get it made...english movies are no problem...most theaters in the bigger cities will have the same showing in the regular english without subs...or they keep the movies as they are and cut out the nudies...and just have arabic subs...either way its not much different excite if your a girl you should never leave the house in shorts and a tank top and if you do go with a scarf around your neck atleast. Men will try to ask you for marriage right on the street and you just politly say no thank you and continue on your way.
If you truely like the guy you should just go and live there for a time become completely self sufficient and then if he is still into you make then you decide. Dont take the advice of someone who doesnt know about this place...besides you can buy liquor and beer and have it delivered or go to bars...and yes they do have bars!

Chelsealk92
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9/1/2013 06:34    
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Thank you for you support Jessica and for sharing your lovely story. I do see and understand where the others are coming from but I speak the language he speaks perfect English and I have work waiting I don't worry for the things like alcohol and movies as I know all of this is possible to get and to see. I'm not going there on the whim of him taking care of me I have come back to the uk to earn money and save so ill have money to live for myself and I won't have to rely on him for everything. He comes from a very good respectable family who are lovely I have not met his mother or sisters but I have spoken with his sister on the phone and have met two of his nephews they all are very supportive of our relationship he has told them all about me an they can not wait to meet me and I think this is lovely considering I'm a English Catholic girl with tattoos and piercings and they have no problem with any of these facts and neither does he. He doesn't expect me to change my faith or beliefs. As I said before he owns his own business's and is just working in the tourist trade to make more money for his family back in Alex as he is the man of this family his father has re married so he provides for his mother and sisters. It's so nice to speak with someone who knows a little bit about this.

melissa1984
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9/1/2013 11:22    
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I think it is very important to take seriously ALL the responses on this website. I am sorry some folks seem them as crap, that is unfair as several good experiences does not undo the others or undo the pain. The main thing is leaving one culture for another is jolting and esp. during this period of serious unrest. I lived in Luxor which is a far cry from Cairo (in good way for me) but remember the folks in the tourist trade can have a different take on things. As was said earlier any problems you may have will not be dealt with by the embassy and if you get married legally your husband has to agree to your leaving the country. As a lawyer, I can tell you that that should concern you even if others don't get that. Look, we all see ourselves as the exception, the one who gets it, but a total departure from your country and the culture you are leaving seems romantic and like an adventure and sometimes is, but I would sell the family farm betting that the odds are against you.

Another piece of info that I thinks weights heavily into this situation is that a dear childhood friend of mine was second in charge at the American Embassy in Cairo. He has his finger on the pulse more than any of us and he said NO ONE LISTENS TO WARNINGS ABOUT MARRYING THE TOURIST RELATED YOUNG GUYS ESP. IN SOUTHERN EGYPT BUT THE PROBLEMS THERE FOR US ARE WAY BEYOND WHAT WE CAN IMAGINE. I believe him. I believe the women on here who have bravely shared their stories while being told their stories are crap and even Lonely Planet has a warning in their publications.
Go slow, trust your gut and remember that many young Egyptian men are under or unemployed and would love other options. I don't blame them, but charm can take you a long way esp. when the men in our countries often lack it. Again, trust your gut and stay vigilent and tell yourself the truth!

melissa1984
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9/1/2013 11:22    
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I think it is very important to take seriously ALL the responses on this website. I am sorry some folks seem them as crap, that is unfair as several good experiences does not undo the others or undo the pain. The main thing is leaving one culture for another is jolting and esp. during this period of serious unrest. I lived in Luxor which is a far cry from Cairo (in good way for me) but remember the folks in the tourist trade can have a different take on things. As was said earlier any problems you may have will not be dealt with by the embassy and if you get married legally your husband has to agree to your leaving the country. As a lawyer, I can tell you that that should concern you even if others don't get that. Look, we all see ourselves as the exception, the one who gets it, but a total departure from your country and the culture you are leaving seems romantic and like an adventure and sometimes is, but I would sell the family farm betting that the odds are against you.

Another piece of info that I thinks weights heavily into this situation is that a dear childhood friend of mine was second in charge at the American Embassy in Cairo. He has his finger on the pulse more than any of us and he said NO ONE LISTENS TO WARNINGS ABOUT MARRYING THE TOURIST RELATED YOUNG GUYS ESP. IN SOUTHERN EGYPT BUT THE PROBLEMS THERE FOR US ARE WAY BEYOND WHAT WE CAN IMAGINE. I believe him. I believe the women on here who have bravely shared their stories while being told their stories are crap and even Lonely Planet has a warning in their publications.
Go slow, trust your gut and remember that many young Egyptian men are under or unemployed and would love other options. I don't blame them, but charm can take you a long way esp. when the men in our countries often lack it. Again, trust your gut and stay vigilent and tell yourself the truth!

melissa1984
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9/1/2013 11:22    
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I think it is very important to take seriously ALL the responses on this website. I am sorry some folks seem them as crap, that is unfair as several good experiences does not undo the others or undo the pain. The main thing is leaving one culture for another is jolting and esp. during this period of serious unrest. I lived in Luxor which is a far cry from Cairo (in good way for me) but remember the folks in the tourist trade can have a different take on things. As was said earlier any problems you may have will not be dealt with by the embassy and if you get married legally your husband has to agree to your leaving the country. As a lawyer, I can tell you that that should concern you even if others don't get that. Look, we all see ourselves as the exception, the one who gets it, but a total departure from your country and the culture you are leaving seems romantic and like an adventure and sometimes is, but I would sell the family farm betting that the odds are against you.

Another piece of info that I thinks weights heavily into this situation is that a dear childhood friend of mine was second in charge at the American Embassy in Cairo. He has his finger on the pulse more than any of us and he said NO ONE LISTENS TO WARNINGS ABOUT MARRYING THE TOURIST RELATED YOUNG GUYS ESP. IN SOUTHERN EGYPT BUT THE PROBLEMS THERE FOR US ARE WAY BEYOND WHAT WE CAN IMAGINE. I believe him. I believe the women on here who have bravely shared their stories while being told their stories are crap and even Lonely Planet has a warning in their publications.
Go slow, trust your gut and remember that many young Egyptian men are under or unemployed and would love other options. I don't blame them, but charm can take you a long way esp. when the men in our countries often lack it. Again, trust your gut and stay vigilent and tell yourself the truth!

marcynabdou
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9/3/2013 08:09    
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hi people i havent commented in awhile since someone said i should wait til i been married 7 years lol but anyway i been reading all the comments and just amazed and saddened at some of them....i am now back in alex been here for a month and plan on staying til we get thru the visa process since my husband can not find work here or in the gulf is what he preferes to do. he still scared of going to united states for the fear he wont be accepted by my kids and find work right away....i try to reassure him things will be fine and they will :) we have ran into problems with people give us the run around about exact proceures and make us waste money but thats the only problem we have had lol...we are still very much in love his family loves me very much also..i was back in the states for 4 months and we both were miserable and lonely without eachother so we make the choice no matter where we are at least we are together.. i love egypt and if he could find work here we would stay here it dont matter to me i can always go back to states and visit :) in four months it will be a year since we first met thru a friend on facebook none of our feelings have changed he has not changed he treat me like a queen even when i am difficult lol he say im a complainer but i still so cute even when i complain hahahaha...he say he is so lucky well trust me i feel very lucky to have had this man come into my life he would never let anything happen to me...so i am mainly writing to let the people that commented on my comment last time that all is still well and to all the other people that think all egyptian men are the same cuz they are not i found my one in a million or should i say he found me :) on that note god bless and may real love find each and every one of u

marcynabdou
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9/3/2013 08:33    
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lol casualcairo on the mmid virus that is hilarious..but on the other hand i agree with u and to think i thought i was a lil crazy but at least me and my husband got to know eachother alot longer than a week..omg yes i think she is definatley crazy and hes a massuese lol yeah um no is what i am thinking...get to know him alot longer than a week...spend some real time and find out what he is about and so on...like alot of people say go with ur gut trust your instincts not just your heart....good luck it could be true but on the other hand it could not be also sometimes u jus have to take a chance :)

Chelsealk92
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9/3/2013 09:40    
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Sorry for the late reply Melissa I think what I failed to post in my first post is I have no intentions in marrying him until I'm completely comfortable and confident with the idea which I clearly am not at the moment or I wouldn't be on here sharing my story. I also understand that his line of work is not highly respected but I have to stress this is only what he does at the moment he has business and owns spas also. As for having to gain permission to leave the country I don't think e would ever stop me yet another reason why I have to be in complete trust with Him. Even tho he would like to marry next year I know this is not what is going to happen I'm going back in the new year to get more familiar with him his family and life in Egypt. I have a house and things in the uk I can not jus abandon so I know when I go out there I will be coming home but I want to spend a few months getting the grounds right and making myself fully aware of life in Egypt. I'm not saying I'm going to jump on a plane and marry him tomorrow no no no no way! When I go for my 6 month visit then this is when I will know more about him and him and me as a couple. I'm not completely blind to the risks and the insanity of the idea but my gut tells me I gotta go an a least see where life might take me. Put it this way ladies and engagement is well off the cards until I come back to the uk in the summer of next year an see how I feel and see if we work out as well as we hope

Chelsealk92
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9/3/2013 10:07    
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Thank you or sharing your story marcyanabdou and I fully appreciate your point that we had only know each other a week. It's now been a month and we are getting to know more n more about each other and our families an this is why I say I'm gonna go away in 2014 for 6 months and see how we take to life with each other long term I have no intentions of flying there getting married and becoming a house wife no marriage will be happening until the end of 2014 or 2015 I want to be established with life in Egypt before I do any such thing as for u laughing at him being a masseuse I don't find that funny as that is not his only profession but its making money in the tourist trade that gave him the opportunity to own his own businesses, his own home, and cars he is very well established and isn't some young ignorant boy he's 30 an comes from a good family in Alex and my trip in 2014 is all about getting to know him properly and his family too! My gut tells me I should go and see what my life could be like and at least try an like u say get to know what he is about etc. I understand that him working in the tourist industry makes every1 think VISA HUNTER but like your partner he has no desire to leave Egypt or his family he is the man of his family and his mother and sisters are his world he would never leave any of them and I would never ask him too.

melissa1984
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9/3/2013 11:44    
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Casual Cairo, western women do not have the rights that we have in America once you MARRY. You are wrong on that. Also, having children once you marry is dicey to say the least. I am talking here not about the rights YOU have but the rights an American or other would have after marriage. You might want to look at human rights watch and look at some of the files I am working on where women are trying to leave the country with their children or get child support.
Also, might want to check in with the embassies about these issues. Regarding the language barriers. Give me a break. I couldn't anymore learn a language that had a different alphabet than fly to the moon and I am a bright, educated woman. How do you think it feels for an English speaking woman to have her husband translating everything for her. And even if she could learn the language it would take a long time and what is it like before that. As far as the movies go, that is true in many parts of Egypt and a non-issue anyway. I meant it as a metaphor regarding a culture that is so different that the most minor expectations are not met. Can we stretch our wings, YES but one must know that when going into it.
You have been in Cairo a long time, try to remember back. Also, you have long established friendships. That takes a long time for most folks and getting a really good job is very, very hard. I don't mean teaching English, I mean teaching at American University in Cairo.
Also, one must take it into consideration just where one is in Egypt. Living in Luxor or Sharm or Aswan are way different that Cairo and Cairo is HUGE. Unless you come from a metropolis the adjustment is huge. These changes are real and I think perhaps minimized when one has lived in Cairo so long. Cairo becomes the norm which is fine but beyond difficult for most westerners. You are in the minority for sure and I admire your ability to make those changes but still, don't minimize the legal differences for women once married.

Chelsealk92
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9/3/2013 14:07    
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Melissa I truly from the bottom of my heart really am great full for the things tht you have bought to my attention in regards to rights once married etc i really am as I keep saying I don't want to marry immediately no way are these my intentions I would be living in dahab and staying in Alex when we visit his family. His home is in dahab I spent two days there when I was on holiday was very different to the resort area that I had originally gone to stay at in taba and I saw such a small part of Egypt my heart aches to see more. I joined this forum for this exactly to get different opinions on different aspects of living in Egypt. I'm in the mists of setting up my own business here in the uk also so I would not be in Egypt all year round. And I already speak Arabic so the laguage isn't an issue

melissa1984
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9/3/2013 17:00    
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Chelsea.......sounds like you are taking a sensible route. Just watch the taking care of the mom and siblings thing. My
BF had the same issue and they will and do come first. That gets old. How is it that you happen to speak Arabic?
You are right, that is a big plus. Nothing like being talked about when you don't know what is being said.
You are right to go slow. The quick marriage approach in Egypt is not something I understand but it seems to be a very common practice. Keep us posted!

marcynabdou
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9/4/2013 02:04    
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melissa i would jus like to say alot of what u say is not true with all egyptian men...for one family doesnt always come first yes they are very important but with me and my husband he makes sure i know i come first and i have every since we got married and his family put me first to they always want me to feel comfortable.. and i dont really mind my husband translating for me arabic is a very hard language i got a couple words down but i dont think i will ever learn it and thats fine by me :) and what is quik to u in marriage i dont think it really matters if u know what ur doing i have seen plenty of people wait years to get married only to end in divorce and thats in america...yes she should be careful espessially at her age because she very young and has her whole life ahead of her so good luck and jus be cautious that is my advice chelsea :)

Chelsealk92
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9/4/2013 05:10    
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I am trying to be sensible and adventurous all at the same time lol. As for him providing for his family he has already told me that we come first but his family will always be a big part of our life which I admire but he's told me I come first n always will. I speak Arabic as my mother was born in Tunisia and my family came to the uk in the 60s I speak French Arabic and English. My Arabic and French aren't perfect but I understand more than I can say which I think is good lol n no there's nothing worse than being spoken about n u don't understand lol

Chelsealk92
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9/4/2013 05:19    
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Thank u Marcy I do Intend on bring very careful as I know I may seem niaeve but I'm not I'm very wise and consider myself to have good judgement of people. His family are very accepting of me which I think is lovely. I am 21 and he is 30 so I don't see him to be looking for anything to gain from me. He has more than I do and only ever says he wants to take care of me and for us to be one. He worries about me being in England where he can not look after me. All I can say is I'm defiantly not getting married yet lol but I can not wait to go back to Egypt and see Alexandria I hear it is beautiful and I can't wait to visit his beautiful city and beautiful family! His nephews already call me Aunty lol that's his fault tho I'm pretty sure it's a joke lol ill defiantly keep u all posted I'm so pleased I joined the forum while I've received some not do positive comments I've defiantly gained some knowledge and Melissa u say your a solicitor ill get in touch if I need some help lol thanks again ladies

marcynabdou
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9/4/2013 08:39    
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You are very welcome and i wish u all the happiness in the world when i met my my husband its like he came out of nowhere and saved me from alot of pain and lonliness and then i find out i did the same for him he was 33 when we met and i 37 i had a life before him was married had 4 kids and he had never been with another woman he thought he would never get married lol me having a previous life didnt deter him and his family had no problems with it either and he really didnt care if they did at first he didnt want them to meet me cuz he didnt want us to be judged but they said nope and they wanted to meet me and here we are im on my second trip to egypt and life couldnt be better...even when i met his sisters they tell me abdou has changed so much he more happy and i could totally tell from the pics he was posting also every pic he posted had my name attached to it which made me fall more inlove than ever..he is the sweetest man i ever have met and the love he shows me everyday is amazing..time goes by so fast it has almost been a year since i met him and we are in love more each and every day so it can happen with the right man :) and on alexandria it is a beautiful city i love it..some places need to be cleaned up because of the revolution but in due time im sure it will all be back to the way it used to be :)

Chelsealk92
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9/4/2013 08:57    
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Thank you for your kind words and all your advice I can only hope and pray Mostafa and I will be as happily in love as abdou and u. Quick question in regards to ur maridge did you have a religious maridge or just a lawful one. Mostafa tells me as I am not prepared to become Muslim we can have a lawful marriage instead of a religious one as you can not join two faiths so we would pretty much be married with a solicitor is this the case or have I misunderstood my lovely habiby lol. When u go to Egypt how long do u spend there each time x

JessicaRafter
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9/4/2013 11:55    
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A muslim man can marrry any faith of the woman...muslim women can not marry anyone except a muslim man. And you can have a religious ceremony if you like...

melissa1984
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9/4/2013 13:24    
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I am very happy that your year long situation has been good for you. May it stay that way. But your experience is your experience and while it is helpful you can see from the 100 plus entries your situation is the exception and that is great for you. You said you have 4 children but are only 37.....are they grown or with you there in Egypt? How do they like it there?

melissa1984
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9/4/2013 14:14    
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I am very happy that your year long situation has been good for you. May it stay that way. But your experience is your experience and while it is helpful you can see from the 100 plus entries your situation is the exception and that is great for you. You said you have 4 children but are only 37.....are they grown or with you there in Egypt? How do they like it there?

melissa1984
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9/4/2013 14:14    
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I am very happy that your year long situation has been good for you. May it stay that way. But your experience is your experience and while it is helpful you can see from the 100 plus entries your situation is the exception and that is great for you. You said you have 4 children but are only 37.....are they grown or with you there in Egypt? How do they like it there?

JessicaRafter
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9/4/2013 16:22    
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A muslim man can marrry any faith of the woman...muslim women can not marry anyone except a muslim man. And you can have a religious ceremony if you like...

marcynabdou
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9/5/2013 09:06    
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we had our civil marriage here and a celebration with his family after that :) when we go back to america we will have an american style wedding also...the first time i was here i stayed a month and now i have been here a month this time but plan on staying with my husband til he can come back with me or if he gets a job in UAE we might go there its all about starting our life and being together which ever way that pulls us..like i said he kinda scared about life in the states but i tell him trust me u will fit in alot more than i am fitting in here lol

marcynabdou
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9/5/2013 09:14    
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Thank u melissa and yes i realize our story is very rare..i tell my husband everyday he is one and a million espessially after the stories i hear on here and other places...as for my age yes i am 38 now and i do have 4 kids 2 of which i had very young i left home when i was 13 because my parents were alcoholics i should have been more careful in my choices then but i was very young and obviously looking for love in the wrong place.. but as my husband says whats done is done i have 4 beautiful smart kids..my oldest be 23 in december and then 21,16, and 14 :) and no they are not with me my two youngest are with their dad right now and when i return they will return to live with me and my husband :)

melissa1984
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9/5/2013 21:37    
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Oh wow Marcy, how much sweeter then for you to have come from an alcoholic home (as did I) and then to have found a refuge and a personal well of happiness. It sounds like you both have found exactly what you needed and wanted and I hope and pray that your path will continue to be a good one. Will you work? Are there English speaking schools for your kids. Egyptians LOVE kids so they will be doted on as you are. So happy for you. Melissa

marcynabdou
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9/6/2013 09:44    
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thank u melissa yes it has been a long road and also thank you for your kind words :) what i meant is when we return to the states my kids will return to live with us there, and hopefully one day i will return to work as for now i am not able i was in a accident last year and almost lost my life. i am suppose to be having surgery on my knee but i have been putting it off because it will be a year long recovery for that and lets jus say at my kids age they cant be there for me very much due to work and school so i will wait til we get home and i have my husband to care for me in that regard :)

swimswith
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1/12/2014 23:14    
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as of several months ago i was his queen. and recently my trip to him was: "you are stupid" and will you give me 50000usd for my mom and dad
after a long 2 weeks of his boring, abusive behavior; he called tonight to ask when i will transfer the money

CasualCairo
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From: Egypt
1/13/2014 07:47    
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If he calls again to ask this again, use these words precisely to answer him.

Fil MISH MISH

It has to do with a very short apricot season in Egypt, but he will understand you are telling him that the answer is WHEN HELL FREEZES OVER.

Good Luck. ;)

melissa1984
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1/13/2014 08:18    
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Thank God you have a life elsewhere, so many are stuck in Egypt basically under house arrest. The culture supports him and using you and treating you badly are common forms of control. Is this guy from Luxor? Tourist places are the worst. Have you kicked him to the curb yet?

melissa1984
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1/13/2014 08:18    
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Thank God you have a life elsewhere, so many are stuck in Egypt basically under house arrest. The culture supports him and using you and treating you badly are common forms of control. Is this guy from Luxor? Tourist places are the worst. Have you kicked him to the curb yet?

kay85
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8/9/2014 15:51    
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hi
I am a girl born and bred in the UK
I am desperately seeking information about marriage papers I signed with an ex Egyptian boyfriend. typical story of we met on a holiday etc to cut a long story short I found out he was seeing at least 1 other person so the relationship ended .. it has been at least 2 years since I had any contact with him and we never lived together. I did sign all the papers and get stamps from embassies in Cairo etc so I am worried this marriage may still be valid even though he said he sorted it. I am in a loving relationship and hope to actually marry this person in the future so I need to know this silly part of my past will not interfere with this. I just want to remove the doubt I have in my mind. I have tried in the past to contact embassies for information but get different info. Can anyone tell me who I need to speak to or how I can be certain these papers are no longer valid.? I have no contact information for the Egyptian.
thanks for your time

melissa1984
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8/12/2014 09:18    
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Don't feel bad. This sting operation is big business and Egyptian men have it down to a fine science. Now about the stamps and embassy involvement. So you got married in Egypt and then went back to England? Where does the Egyptian live because if it is in Egypt he can end the marriage quickly but it would be hard to believe him plus who knows where he is? Did you ever report the marriage on your passport or anywhere else official in England? Yes, the embassies won't help you. Let me know about the reporting out thing and we can go from there. MB

kay85
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8/12/2014 10:34    
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Thank you so much for replying. I don't really know what the reporting out thing is but I didn't do anything else with any documents after leaving Cairo .. I didn't change my name or anything. I had to give in my passport and proof of christening etc when I was there and it took over a week to complete in Cairo. He basically was convinced if he married a European he would be exempt from army service and then able to get a passport . He said he did end it but like you say I don't trust him. I want peace of mind for myself and my partner that I can marry and even holiday in Egypt without any problems. The documents I have are the one in Arabic with out pics and thumb print and an English translated one.
Feel like this all happened a life time ago yet I'm still living with a worry and feel there's no one that can give me a definitive resolution.
Thanks again x

kay85
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8/12/2014 10:51    
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He always lived in Egypt and I in the UK .. I don't think I even went back after the papers were done and I never declared married on anything here that I can recall .. I even went to my local vicar and he tried finding out how legit it was but couldn't find out much either way.

melodymckinley
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8/12/2014 20:12    
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Pardon me, but I thought I would add something here. It seems to me from the information you shared so far, that you did not go through the process of a legal marriage. Such as, filing your marriage with the marriage court, going through the long process that can take many days, going to the Ministry of justice, getting a certified translation lawyer and stamped. If it was not done through a legal marriage court lawyer, a dowry or mahr was not payed, no oath was sworn by either of you, before the judge magistrate in the marriage court, and you mentioned there was no finger or thumb print or passport photos were submitted at the time of your marriage, then it sounds every bit like you did not have a legal marriage. Rather, it sounds like you had what is popularly called an ORFI or URFI marriage. Just barely legal enough to give him permission to have sexual relations with you, but without any of the financial responsibility that goes along with taking care of a real Wife. During the marriage, or after, should it end. My heart goes out to you for this deception that has been done to you. Just be wiser in all your future dealings with anyone, including your new potential intended, however nice he may be. If you found this Egyptian lover (for that is all he truly was under Egyptian family marriage law,) has only offered you an orfi marriage, you can be sure that if he has been deceiving you in one area, such as fidelity, it is likely he also was deceptive in other aspects as well. You are right to question and not trust his words. The tricky business with getting an orfi divorce, is that you may have to go back to the cleric or person that "married" you, and request divorce, and get it in writing. If you have any marriage papers from this orfi marriage, this will help. Orfi marriage is a messy, shady business, because orfi marriage is not a real or legal marriage. It is similar to what is known in most western countries as common law marriage. Without proper documentation and all legal procedures followed through, plus witnesses you can track down, it is very difficult to actually get a "real" divorce, as it was never a "real" marriage. As I mentioned, if you have documentation about your orfi marriage, and you can track down and locate the person who performed the marriage, then you may be able to get further documentation to proof you are not truly married. As embarrassing and expensive as this solution may sound, it may be the only way for you to get complete peace of mind. If you return to Egypt and are to booking a room in a hotel with a new Husband, or rent an apartment or villa, that requires marriage papers, as most of the respectable ones do, and have not been previously divorced, it is punishable by Egyptian law by imprisonment. I advice you not to remarry without being quite sure you are truly divorced from your first husband. I hope you get this worked out and can move on into your happy future, and possibly with someone who truly cares for you. Good Luck to you!

kay85
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8/13/2014 05:16    
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Hi
Thank you for taking the time to respond. I may not have made it clear but what we signed did take a few days and we did go through the ministry of justice etc. I have a copy of the paper with out thumb print and pics. I guess this is a more legal marriage :(
He messaged me out if the blue around 2 years ago saying he had ended it but I don't know how I can be sure. Is there no one that I can call ? No register that will say if the marriage is valid?
My current partner had never been to the pyramids and has said he'd like to at some point in his life but is now worried for me being there. I could contact his sister in law (she is polish) however I really want to avoid him contacting me if possible and I want to keep it as private as I can.

marie222
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8/23/2014 15:15    
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hi becs i read your messages on the forum and just want to ask a few questions. i met an egytian man in sharm who claims he really like me. we talked for about a week in the hotel but he could not talk to me properly as he works there so asked me to meet him outside one night. i said ok but i explained that i didnt want a relationship or anything and that i just wanted to talk. as soon as i met him he took my hand and i was trying to get him to let go but he wouldnt. i actually was shocked as thought that holding hands in public wasnt allowed. then we went across the road and sat outside a bar and had a drink(just water as i didnt want achohol) then he tried kissing me and i thought what on earth is he doing . i said i did not come there for that. he was really sweet and we talked for a bit and then i said i want to go back to my hotel so i did and he went home. thing is i really like him and now im back in uk he has been calling me everyday asking me when im going back, what do you think of this situation?

kay85
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8/23/2014 19:51    
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Obviously just forget it. Say nice to have met you and leave it there. He sounds too forceful anyway, if he were in the uk I doubt you'd bother believe me. X

Irma
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10/14/2014 09:01    
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somebody is sending me private messages ; Johanna .......i wil answer in public......be transparant ....no all Dutch women i KNOW came back, unhappy.....i guess the women who are happy are not writing here. Please tell the happy stories

noturns
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10/20/2014 04:48    
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chelsealk92
I am Christian married to a Egyptian man who is Muslim. There seems to be many answers to each question depending on who is speaking. But to answer your question.your "fiance" is right sort of. You can not have a religious ceremony because you are of different faiths BUT be sure that your civil ceremony is legitimate. Signing a form in a solicitors office is a convenient form of marriage (for the man) but it is not a legal marriage and not accepted when you are required to show proof of marriage in hotels or checkpoints. You can fill out the proper forms at your embassy in Cairo and then they will send you to have the marriage performed. OR you can have a civil wedding in a courthouse
Just a comment on life married to a muslim Egyptian....there are soooooo many differences from how you grew up......so many
Smile
noturns

memomemo
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10/20/2014 08:48    
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hello :) im new here and read all with interes .thank you for sharing your stories and advices ..i want to ask if someone can help me ..i have a very good friend from egypt and i want to help him to move abroad but i cant find good information how to do that and how much will cost ..if someone can give me info i will be very thankful :) thank you in advance :) wish you wonderful new week

Irma
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10/26/2014 07:44    
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it depends where you live Memo

CasualCairo
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From: Egypt
10/26/2014 11:56    
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Memo - Put the responsibility on HIM to find out this information. Do NOT do it for him. If he will do his own research and fill out the forms and stand in line at the appropriate Embassy and all of that, then he may be worth helping once he gets there, but take it as a sign that he is lazy and not real bright (that sounds tough, but it's sooooo true) if he won't do the leg work up front to make this happen. Its more to HIS benefit to get there than yours, so make him do the work. PLEASE! You won't regret it if you do..... well hopefully you won't still regret it if you do. :)

Irma
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10/26/2014 13:05    
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wise words; let him do the work !

dancers
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From: Egypt
10/26/2014 15:54    
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All I can say (from my own experience....I am American....he....Egyptian)....is this.....LOVE DON'T PAY THE BILLS!!!!! I was the "ALLOWER" for TOOOOOOOOO LONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! GOOD LUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

marcynabdou
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10/26/2014 19:52    
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Update me and abdou are still together we have a 5 month old now named alexander.abdou got to America one week before he was born and he was born on my birthday god has blessed us so much and I just wanted to share with you guys. He is working as soon as he got his green card and is now looking for bodybuilding sponsorship to pursue his dreams in that. So don't give up on love it is out there..it just is very rare to find it 7000 miles away and it be real hence that's why this thread is here haha..but it can happen look at us March will be 2 years we r married now :) and I have met a couple others it has happened to along the visa journey..so don't give up just be careful no matter where the man comes from lol have a great day friends

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