TheresaIT
3/8/2017 14:29 EST
Looking ahead, I'll be 65 next year and will incur a penalty unless I sign on Part B of Medicare. I met with someone at Social Security yesterday, who said the only way I can opt out of Park B and not be penalized is if I am working for an employer who is providing health insurance. (The Nat'l Health System in Italy doesn't qualify, nor does purchasing private insurance.)
The penalty is pretty stiff - if out of the country for 1 year, it's a 10% penalty for the rest of my life. If out of the country for 5 years, it's a 50% penalty, and so on.
Has anyone found a way around this?
I will likely move back to the U.S. at some point in time -my son is here, but could be 1 year, 5 years, 10 years...who knows?
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TheresaIT
3/8/2017 14:49 EST
Hi John,
I can't use Medicare outside of the U.S. In my view, it doesn't make sense to pay $134 a month, (in addition to rising costs) if I am out of the country for five or 10 years and not using the service. I will also be paying taxes in Italy, which, in part, will go towards my participation in the National Health System.
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JacksterJam
3/8/2017 14:54 EST
I am glad that you posted this question as it is one I've recently started contemplating as I get nearer to age 65. As far as I know, the only exceptions are those that you were told, but I'd be interested to know if anyone has other information since I also do not know for how long I will live in Italy. Your comment, "I will also be paying taxes in Italy, which, in part, will go towards my participation in the National Health System" also caught my attention. I have been paying income taxes in Italy and it does not qualify me for any type of access to the public health care system; it is a separate cost entirely. But, things do change and if you can reference a source for that information, it would be much appreciated.
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TheresaIT
3/8/2017 14:58 EST
Hi Jackster Jam,
Sorry - perhaps I misspoke regarding taxes paid in Italy going partially towards the health system. Being a public program, I assumed part of my taxes would be going into the system. Perhaps someone else can clarify.
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john98103
3/8/2017 15:00 EST
Well, if you're planning to return to the US at some point, you have no choice (well you do, but option B will be expensive).
But, odds are pretty good that donnie and his pals will eliminate medicare, so the question will be moot.
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JacksterJam
3/8/2017 15:04 EST
As far as I know, per my Italian tax accountant, they do not. One has to buy into the public health care system, which is separate from paying income tax. I have more information on that. If you would like, I can send you a private message to discuss.
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TheresaIT
3/8/2017 15:07 EST
That would be great. Any info is greatly appreciated. I will look for your PM.
Thanks much!
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TheresaIT
3/8/2017 15:09 EST
Yup, that is a good point. Have been thinking the same - who knows where things will be down the line? As you say, could be a moot point. Fortunately, I have a year to decide.
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lifelover
3/8/2017 15:16 EST
Just stay there@theresaIT , I have grown kids in US too, they never stay put anyways.
Can I get the info on how to buy into Italian healthcare too please?
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JacksterJam
3/8/2017 15:35 EST
I didn't want to hijack the post on Medicare, so I will also send you a pm. Will be arriving soon. :)
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DoppioCittadino
3/8/2017 16:47 EST
Jackster,
Non-citizens have to buy into the Italian healthcare system by way of an annual premium.
Italian citizens get it for "free" as part of their basic tax payments.
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DoppioCittadino
3/8/2017 16:52 EST
On this site https://www.mymedicarematters.org/enrollment/am-i-eligible/?SID=58c05f9e26811 under the section titled, "I am a U.S. citizen living outside the United States" it says:
"Be aware that if you plan to move back to the United States in the future, it may advisable to sign up for Medicare when you are first eligible. In most instances, if you do not sign up for Part B then and subsequently move back and want to enroll, you may have to pay a penalty based on the time you went without Part B. You will have to continue to pay this penalty for as long as you have Medicare."
Assuming this is correct, then yes, the penalty applies even to persons living outside the US and covered by another plan.
However, I am almost certain that I read somewhere else that proof of other coverage will get you a pass on the penalty - just as proof that you were still working and covered by an employer health plan.
I may very well be wrong, though.
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LisaC1
3/8/2017 17:11 EST
Jackster, Could you send me a pm with the names and contact info of your US/Italian accountants and attorneys? I am compiling a list of potential resources to contact about our upcoming move. Thanks so much. Lisa
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LisaC1
3/8/2017 17:11 EST
Jackster, Could you send me a pm with the names and contact info of your US/Italian accountants and attorneys? I am compiling a list of potential resources to contact about our upcoming move. Thanks so much. Lisa
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TheresaIT
3/8/2017 17:34 EST
That's correct, DoppioCittadino. Thus far, the only way to avoid the penalty is to working for an employer who pays your insurance. Thought there might be a loophole somewhere.
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DoppioCittadino
3/8/2017 17:45 EST
John,
"What does it cost for non-Italian senior citizens?"
The amount is based on your annual income. The low limit, if I recall correctly is somewhere around $450 per year.
I could be way off though. I will see if I can locate the correct numbers.
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JacksterJam
3/8/2017 23:45 EST
My understanding is that, even as a worker, income taxes and health care payments are two separate deductions. That is, workers pay into the health care system, but that is separate deduction as part of their "social contribution," which ranges from 8.89% to 10.89 % of income. I can't find the exact numbers as to cost for a non-citizen, but for a non-Italian retiree to qualify for a visa, I do recall that at that level of income, the annual fee to participate in the public health care system is in the 2,200 euros per year range, but maxes out at 2,700 euros. The costs have increased dramatically over the past several years. For example, I know an American retiree who was charged 387 euros each of the first two years to participate in the public health care system, but Italy re-calculated their fee structure and starting the third year, her cost was 2,400 euros per year. I did have the exact calculations at one point for myself, but I can't locate them.
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rsetzer99
3/9/2017 06:48 EST
From friends I have from other regions, the amount they charge you seems very much who is running things at the moment. In Umbria they got hit with a requirement that their Social Security statements be 'certified', they all had a big fire drill and eventually it was settled out that the US Embassy could send them something signed and the local officials were satisfied. Another up in Venato says everyone just gets the flat rate minimum. In not too much longer, I will be discovering how they run things here in the Chieti province.
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TheresaIT
3/9/2017 07:58 EST
I just may do that, lifesaver, particularly with how things are unraveling here.
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john98103
3/9/2017 11:28 EST
TheresaIT -
Can you elaborate on 'how things are unraveling here'?
Are you in the US?
Thanks
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Sergios
3/9/2017 12:59 EST
Without being political I think what is being said is that what has been taken for granted in the past may nolonger be reliable in the future. The government having moved towards the right in the USA could mean cuts in social security and madicare in the near future. Wether those changes will effect current recipients or just future ones is not yet clear.
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JacksterJam
3/9/2017 13:28 EST
Actually, social security, Medicare and Medicaid benefits have been fairly regularly cut during the last administration; the most significant was a cut to Medicare of $715+ billion in 2012 alone to help fund the ACA. It's not a right or left, issue. Cuts have been occurring all along.
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JacksterJam
3/9/2017 13:34 EST
Eek. There I go again not proofreading - please excuse the errors. :) Also, I did intend to imply that cuts weren't made until the last administration was in place. I meant that cuts have been made by presidents on both sides of the aisle for a number of years.
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lifelover
3/9/2017 13:43 EST
It would be interesting to know how many dollars per receipient it has gone down since the last cut ( and addition of ACA) personally, I think it would be foolhardy to depend on that money if you are not already receiving it.
Now, healthcare in your 60's will cost 18k a year to buy.
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