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Building in Panama

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smithmic2
  7/28/2016 12:48 EST

Hi. Just found the Expat Exchange I'm loving all the information I'm finding. My wife and I are retiring to Panama next year and will be renting around the Coranado area at first but then plan to build a home on our land in Penonome. Have any of you build a home in Panama? Any tips to tales to share? Thanks.

XSMEMORIES
  7/28/2016 17:22 EST

Hi yes I have when you get here contact me, I want to introduce you to what I believe is the best builder in the area he knows what to do and how to get all the permits and stands behind his work he's a builder from Canada and has been in this country for over 20 yrs., reputable honest. Sheila [email protected]

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RICOBREEZE802MARK
  7/29/2016 03:28 EST

o yeah. I have done a lot of building in this country. first tip, if you buy some blue prints you like, even tho they are stamped from the states, you must have one of them do them here, those will not be taken.

your building permit cost depends on how much they say your home will cost to build.

I hope your land already has power close or running past it, if not, YOU will pay for all wire, post and transformers needed to get power to you, then the power company owns it and anyone can hook up to it for free.

do you have a water line where you are? if not you will have to have a well dug. that's around 1,200.00 depend on how deep tho.

You will be using concrete blocks in this country and most have not even been strong enough to pass their stress test, last I read something like 7 did, hundreds more did not. but yet they still make them and sale them. back in the states, you could rest a car on two blocks and crawl under it, if you try that here, make sure your wife knows where your life ins. policy is.

panama has a dry season and a rainy season, plan your job during dry season, to at least be weathered in before the rain starts, then you can work inside in the dry.

If you dare to even think about doing any sheetrock work, inside the house, I will hunt you down and kick you in your A@@. or after maybe a year you will be doing it yourself and thinking why didn't I listen to that guy. I don't care what type of roof you use, or how well it is put on, your roof will leak. I only use drop ceilings. also many workers here have never worked with sheetrock.
another point is humidity, nothing like sheetrock to suk up the water and grow mold. same goes for carpet, you can forget about it. so leave the vac at home. all tile floors sweep and mop, done. carpet will rot within no time, plus smell due to being wet, and again you will have mold. again if I come by and see you used carpet, re read the above.

anything you buy, like paint, title, kitchen handles, buy far more then you will ever need. let me tell you why first off I wanted to update our kitchen handles, so off to one of the chain stores, I had to go to 15 stores, finding 5 here, 3 here ect to get 46 that I needed for the job and I have 4 more just for spares. why spares? because none of these stores have ever restocked those.

title, same way, don't think because you bought what you needed and then you needed more, that that will have more, many times it was a one shot run and they can't get anymore. so what happens when you drop something in the middle of your living room and you bust a title? well you will have to have it busted out which means the guy doing it breaks at least two more doing it, so you need three, and you can't go buy them? humm maybe you can tell your wife that three black titles in the middle of her all cream titled living room looks great,, yeah remember the A@@ kicking I said I would give you? lol I will sit that one out and let your wife take care of that one for me.. also do not get out your tape and say ok so many sq feet or meters needed and buy that amount, they waste and break more then you could ever dream about. if you need say ten boxes you better buy 15. they like to do the side wall in title trim, if you are not looking they will not use a title that has a broken end but could still cut that piece out of it, o no, a new whole one.
paint? sure, sherwan williams, a known paint store, I walk in with the color number my wife gave me, needing 5 gals. they mix it, looks nothing like the color code, far lighter, but then I needed one more gallon, so I went back to them with the same color chart tab,, theirs mind you, and at first the guy told me he was sorry they couldn't do one gallon to match the 5 gals I just bought. huh? what? but here is the code, color is color, volume shouldn't change it. nope, can't do it, so I bought 5 gals more.. you want to guess the next part? dang your good at this game, yeah it didn't match the first wrong color.

ok you will not be building your home out of wood. nope. cabinets ok, but that is all. wood here is high priced, and it will not last. the bugs will eat you to the ground. even your wood furniture is not safe from them. you will use metal studs here. they come in all sizes and lengths. hint number 50 learn to weld if you don't already know how too. or if you are planning to build it yourself.

you want a 2nd floor? start adding dollars. 2nd floors here are great, better view yak yak, but they add a ton of weight, a four inch poured floor across it with title, your furniture, the metal decking you pour on and with 2 by 8 studs under it cost a lot, plus add in some beams because once again those concrete blocks won't hold weight like the ones back home. so think long and hard before you draw a 2nd floor, better off a larger one level.

plus, we have earthquakes here a lot, small ones but some of my new projects have cracks down the whole wall, in the center of blocks, this is another reason to have extra paint around, so you can patch that wall and touch up paint it.. and it has nothing to do with shotty work.

ground work, depends on where and your soil. but again think rainy season, wet ground tends to sink and move, so prep your ground before you start, pack it, I have had to bring in river stones and run my tractors and dump trucks over them to force them into the ground. you might be able to just hand pack and beat your ground in good. house location and water drains are a must, plan on not good but great drainage away from your home. from foundations to roof run off. make sure to build your lot up before you build your house on it, so even yard water will drain away from you.

learn where that water goes on your lot before you build as well, in dry season you won't think about it, during rainy a dry lot might be 2 foot under standing water.

concrete bags, run about 10.00 per bag here and they are all about the same. one is really no better then the other. so use what is close.

sand.. we have two types, ocean beach sand and river sand. river sand is cheaper, because it has more little stones in it. ocean sand has small sea shells in it. both will need to be throw by shovel through a screen to remove those. river sand tho, is perfect for driveways, and foundations. I would screen it for block mix tho. I would NOT use ocean sand, main reason is salt, which from day one will start to eat up your rebar. plus it cost more. salt will also come up through title and paint.

If you go with a builder, a few tips, first off get everything in writing, make sure if he has a contract, it is a fair and bal. one for you and him. 2nd check everything they do. 3rd, pay him a draw when work is done in steps. never allow them to get far money ahead of you. they can just not show up.. 4th.. this is a big one, buy the supplies they need to build your home yourself. Your builder might be able to buy it cheaper sure, but do you think he is going to pass that savings on to you? ahhh nope. plus stores like novey, coche, do it center, you sign up and they give you a card, every time you buy something hand them your card you get points based on how much you spend. That really adds up, I mean think about it, I have had a shopping spree with 600.00 free stuff many times. and you get points on whatever you buy, say a chair, or bedding, it's just not only for building materials. o and if your builder is buying it all, he won't tell you about that either, lots of points for him to use.

compare prices, I have found that a lot of building places here are people from china, you can beat the big chain stores prices on a lot of things, many times I say no tax, and low price, they will bring it down for you. so you save 7 percent, plus a little off the price of a item already cheaper then you can buy it on the big chain.

dang you already owe me dinner with DRINKS.

sewers and grease traps. I don't think your town has city sewers, so it's back to the old septic system. so does your ground perk? make it bigger then you would think. and keep it treated, make sure your flow in and out is right. grease trap will save you a lot of money and problems as well, one that you can open and check and empty when needed. after all a backho is 50.00 per hour, so stake it out and have a pipe showing him how deep to go and then have him dig the run off. You can buy one of plastic or build one out of blocks and cement, cheaper and larger. but again you would have to check to see if they will allow the block type in your area. biggest thing to remember is the slope of pipes to it, 1/4 inch drop per foot. more then that and the water will run off and leave your solids behind. momma aint happy.

roofs many to pick from. they have the small concrete type shinges, those place a lot of weight on your roof, which means more dollars for you to have to spend. you have the concrete panel type that come in many lengths. those you screw them into your metal beams. hospa has a metal roof, comes in colors, that has about 3 to 4 inches of styrofoam glued to the under side of it. perfect for insulation. then looking up at it from inside your house, you can add more of the roll out type insulation to that, then your drop ceiling. they don't use fiberglass or spray insulation here that much again, due to water.
Keep in mind where you are going to live, it gets HOT HOT HOT, and power here is not cheap, running a a/c system for the whole house will cost you plenty. so spend the money for insulation, don't just do what you think is standard, you can't over do it, and over time it will repay you. then you will want to only a/c a few rooms not the whole house, unless money isn't a factor for you. window units here are cheaper then then split type units. I can get a 24k btu for 380.00 a split unit same btu will cost you 500.00 and up. so keep that in mind before you build for the window unit opening as well as a 220 volt plug.

I also can not stress enough to over build everything, your power lines, coming into the main box to inside home. use heavier gauge wire then they will want too. Also surge protectors, on EVERYTHING, I even have one on the main wires to the main box. then I have everything else on them inside the home. I also have a tripp lite power battery back up. this allows me at least a hour to safety shut down my computers. but the thing I love about it most is it shows me 24 7 how much power is coming in my home. right now I have 125. and I have seen this thing go from 40 to 150. buy at pricesmart around 140,00. most people don't understand that under power to anything harms it just as much as a power spike, those power protection strips everyone buys, only protect you from over current, because it stops it, but it will never stop undercurrent. I have in my ten years here lost thousands of dollars worth of tv's, radios, computers, a/c, ref. ect. yes you can make a claim to the power company, but you will be a old man before you ever see any money and when you do it will not be enough to replace one item much less three or four. so again spend the money to protect what you have, or replace it and move on.

windows.. you can buy already pre sized windows with screens at all building supply houses. or you can get custom ones made at a glass shop. you can also get the crank out style. I don't like those, a kid can pull the metal back and slip out as made of those as he needs to reach into your home, they like to use a long pole with a hook on the end to slide it inside and hook your purse or watch or whatever they can hook. slider windows are best, you will also have to weld bars around all of them. keep in mind again, use heavy metal not just rebar or small rods, they have been know to place a car jack between them and jack them right apart. also make the bars close, they like to slip in a small child who then goes and unlocks your doors, while you are sleeping.

budget to spend at least 10k on making your home a hard target for crimes. cameras, recorders, window bars, outside lights, motion lights, fence, dogs, inside and out, loud alarms. signs warning no trespass, beware of dogs, beware of wife, and 24/7 night recording cameras are watching you!! I even have motion points, that are set high off the ground so a dog or cat can't set it off, only a person over 5 ft. solar powered, so no wires and it dings in my house to let me know someone in that pitch darkness just walked across this area. again spend the money on the things that will pay it back.

back to windows, I had 6 customs ones made, they are really great, the only thing was it took them a lot longer to get them done then the man told me, and many trips to his shop to voice that I was not happy, still waited far to long for them to be done. they get paid up front, so o well we do them when we do them.

pools are nice to have, for the heat down there, so keep that in mind for later if you think of putting one in, that goes back to water flow, and sewer pipes and drains, that you are putting in now for the house, in ground one piece fiber pools have taken off here lately, I went with a in ground concrete type, plan on around 50k plus 100 per month power, and maybe 50 for chemicals. again build more then you need, remember earthquakes? last one busted every one of my pretty blue top title trim on one side of my pool.

everything here rust, so when you are using iron for windows, or support pole, paint it all. wd 40/ buy it by the case. anything you store here, spray it down, even tools in a locked tool room in the house will rust.

plan on building one room as a dry room, where you can store clothes, tools, photos, books. paperwork ect, have that room with a dehumidifier running at all times one with a garden hose screw in the back so it can drain right outside, no buckets to empty. and seal that room up tight.

My girl moved in and had to have a/c so I put in a 24k btu for a bedroom, yes it gets cold enough to hang meat in there, but after we get up and turn it off, she opens the two door to that room, and in about 40 mins. there is water running down the walls, and the floor is all wet, she makes it rain in our bedroom.

water lines, understand that they have water lines for cold and water lines for hot. that was a costly little lesson I learned the hard way. hot water lines are rated as well, so you can get them from x to x. which will handle hotter. on demand hot water gas tanks... yeah yeah saves money, cheaper they say, bla bal bal.. don't waste your money on these blanky blanky pieces of blanky go with a power tank. yeah some here will tell you, o we have never had trouble out of ours, yeah ok. I own about ten of them, because I own a hostel, but my home has a huge power hot water tank, and I have already put one at the hostel and will be changing the rest out. the batteries play out fast, no hot water, your water pressure has a lot to do with you having hot water or not, with those systems, you also have to play with the mix, back and forth to get it hot then it's to hot then ice cold again. not worth the trouble. plus again they will rust out. again check everything, even ground wires to the main box and hot water tank, mine last week shocked me when I reached to turn it off, went out and pulled the top and the ground was rusted, fixed that fast. had my girl test it tho just to make sure it was right. something as small as that can really get you down here and that is something I never would have dreamed about until it popped me a good one, then I knew right away. same as the main power lines coming into the house, those the power company has to come out once a year and clean or you have power drop.

things many people don't think about until to late, does your boss like hammocks? if so while building, go buy two sets of the hooks, you can weld and cement them into the walls where ever you want them and she will be set. front, back where ever, they only cost around 3.00 each.

use sch 40 pipes only, yes I know they will cost you more but again you want a half a@@ job? sch40 pipes for everything. 4 inch sewer pipes as well.. the glue here isn't the best tho. I have seen a water line pop right off of a fitting after having been glued. in the states, that glue melts them into one, never to be parted, not here.

take your phone camera and take photos of everything. each day. many times I have gone back and had to look at a photo to show me where that pipe ran and how. plus it's great to look back on it and say wow look at it back then and now. this is also good for any problems with a builder.
permits are not hard to get, get the paperwork together you need, get the right stamps on it, pay the fees.

what I like to do is work the jobs myself, no builder, well let me back that up I like to over see the work not work. I hire a few good workers and supply them with the materials they need and say dig here do this do that. pay for them is about 25.00 per man per day. hire more when you have a lot of work to get done then let them go afterwards. like pouring a slab, sure you need 6 guys, mixing on the ground, then wheel it in place, so you have more labor cost those few days, but you got all that hard work out of the way. you don't need 6 guys, when they are welding the beams for a roof, two are working while the rest are trying to look like they are working. let me make that point VERY plain.. these two guys are hired to work one day for me. one. I fire them after each work day. then I ask you want to work tue? why? and this goes back to hiring a builder, he must pay them x amount, plus bonus, if they work on a weekend or holiday, they get double pay, then s.s. payments must be paid in on each worker, then when the job is done each worker gets paid a bonus based on time worked there. all of those fees are added to you from your builder. you need a guy to wire your home, hire one, need blocks laid, hire a few guys for a weeks worth of work. piece each job out one step at a time, your money is low? you can stop at any point, till you have time to rebuilt it. you can't with a builder. you want to change something, you didn't like or want to add, you can, your builder can, but he will charge you more to do that. more then it would cost you to say hey you guys pour more 4 more feet out that way.
If you have a problem with a builder, he could tie your home up in court until you are old and gray. courts here move like snails backwards sometimes. avg two years for a court date. yep not kidding. will a builder do the best for you, looking out to get you the best price on things, and best workmanship? well of course some will do that, but many others want to get that job done as fast as they can, to get paid off and move on.

never buy a lot of building materials and have them stacked up on site.. trust me things here like cement and metal beams will grow legs over night and walk the heck right out of your yard, same as tools.

I also wanted to point out, that I don't build anything, for anyone but myself, so I am not looking or telling you all this to get myself a job. I have far to much building going on for me and am tied up for the next 5 years at least. I am just trying to throw a lot of things at you for you to think about, many you may have already known and is no help to you at all. but maybe one thing I have typed might save you time and money which is why I took the time to write this book. plus It's late and I am bored. anyway if you have any questions then post them and I will try to help you anyway I can.

BoqueteGirl
  7/29/2016 10:38 EST

RIGHT-ON RICO

YES to everything he said. We built about 5 years ago in Boquete, and are now building a home in Florida. What a huge difference a country makes,

outsidecleanupset
  7/29/2016 19:54 EST

Right on! Thanks

smithmic2
  8/1/2016 08:21 EST

Thank you. I will keep that in mind as the time draws closer.

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smithmic2
  8/1/2016 08:44 EST

Thanks for the lengthy write up. You hit on many of the things I had questions about. I already knew about the no-drywall or carpeting and certainly intend to have a very hands on approach to building. 50k for a pool?? Wow....maybe I'll put a liner in my pickup and fill it with water instead. I'd like to think I have a little advantage here as my wife (aka boss) is from Penonome and her family has a few lawyers and engineers in it. I have not seen the land personally so I'll reserve my commitment to build until I do.

Travelocity
  8/1/2016 10:49 EST

to add to this quote:
"never buy a lot of building materials and have them stacked up on site.. trust me things here like cement and metal beams will grow legs over night and walk the heck right out of your yard, same as tools."

I had a friend who finally found a lot and a place to build her beach home. she went ahead w/ the husband and hire a local guy to start doing it. then b/c nobody was on site inspecting their work, they were told to hire an inspector to at least see what they had been doing was right. it turns out, the metal bars were stolen, they were building the house without them and they did not tell them to buy more. it's a hands on job in my opinion. you must be there, also I have witness perpetual construction sites, I think these people got a job for life. you must be there, did I say you must be there, you must!!
I also had a neighbor who bought a lot and build her beach house, she told me the times she got stood up, no show. the 2 years driving back and forth doing a 2 hr commute each day, each way,. that is way to much for me, but live nearby or camp on the back, not sure what to tell you. it's a big commitment and it can be a long one too,. she told me she would never do it again, or wouldn't have done if she knew the work involved in it. They say building a house is a test of a marriage.

stgibson
  8/1/2016 10:54 EST

I am a US engineer/commercial design builder with 30 years experience in the US and 5 years in Costa Rica that built here in 2014. I am sick of typing replies here for 20 or 30 minutes only to have them disappear. If you would like my reply email me at [email protected].

volcan357
  8/3/2016 00:25 EST

Building a house here in Panama is not an easy task. If you know nothing about building and can't speak Spanish then your project will end up being a disaster. I have built 4 houses here in Panama. I am very fluent in Spanish and know a lot about building but it still is not easy. I pay my workers by the day and am personally involved with every detail of the contraction process. I pick them up every morning and take them home at night. Sometimes they are drunk and miss days. I just accept that as being normal. The thing you have to be careful about is plumbing. It is very frustrating to have leaks inside a cement floor or wall. You have to decide every detail in the construction of your house. I would never consider trusting a contractor to build a house for me. And I don't care who he is.

volcan357
  8/3/2016 21:20 EST

I pay the helpers $20 a day and skilled people $30. But I don't pay any extra benefits. If it is a longer project I give them something extra when it is finished. I have never bothered with building permits but now it is getting more necessary. I built a house in David near the airport about 12 years ago. The city engineer came out because the neighbours complained so I ended up paying him $150 to draw up some plans. which I never used. He was supposed to get us a permit but never did and the house was finished. Now 12 years years later the house is still there with no permit and was never registered. So if you look in the public register it is only a lot with no house on it. Typical Panama. What do you expect?

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dunnee
  8/4/2016 18:42 EST

Passive Water Systems
Use your "septic system" for the bathroom only. All other water systems run out onto your yard-land. Use bio soaps. Have a hand dug water well near your kitchen. "city water" cost $50 a year, also pipe it nearby. Do "rain water harvesting:" off the roof. Buy water storage tanks and go with 1-2 HP pump and diaphram
tank 25-45 GAL for good PSI all over your home and future garden-drip system. If the tanks get low use the "city water" to fill them in the "dry season". A "solar water heater" is easy to build and gives 8-10 hours a day wash&shower. 1,rain water to run the house. 2, city water to drink and cook(I filter that also). 3, well water when city water is poor or dry(for $50 a year it happens). It took me some years to pull all the systems together and am happy with them.
Regards.

Panama2017
  8/4/2016 18:57 EST

dunnee, what type of water filtration system fo you recommend?

dunnee
  8/6/2016 17:36 EST

I do not live in PCity, but I use a Culligan 2lt. with replaceable filters. Do-It Center, $20, for my city&well water. If you want to go to $400+or- UV filter systems have been here for some years. I would only have this at the kitchen sink for longevity, not unlike overusing the septic system.
Between the roof and water storage tank/s I
have AZUD 2"SuperHelix, per 4000lt/1100gal.
storage tanks. This is the "disk" filter and I was told can last 10 years with proper care.
Disclaimer; my last chore for the "rainwater harvesting" system is to install the gutters, and the filters which will be against the wall of the "waterhouse" for support and direct injection into the filters with a "snorkel" when the rains go into what I call a "white-out". If you know what that is like.
OK My roof collection area is 2000 sq.ft. During a good 2 hour thunder shower (not a white-out at all) I clocked in 1,600 gal. per hr.
and I thought 3,300 gal. of storage was a big deal.
After the tanks and pump I use a 3/4in. string filter $18, at Franklin and change the filters when algae shows up. Last claim I have been using "city water" in the system for 2-3 years which has worked out to be a true test of the system. This has been a fun project.
Do your best, regards.

Cao428
  8/21/2016 11:33 EST

This was excellent advice, and helpful just to learn what to look for in purchasing a house ...thank you so much for taking the time to write this. It also gave me a realistic look at the culture.

Charlesbsa
  1/20/2017 06:16 EST

Dude thanks for your insightful synopsis.

I am currently in South Africa but wish to move (semi retire) to Veraguas Panama next year.

I saw in your post that the blocks there are quite rubbish what are the standard sizes. Is it worth it to take a block making machine?

Does anybody use in situ panel castings?

Do you perhaps know if the is a national building code and where I could get a copy of that?

Lastly the earthquake protection are the foundations designed to be moveable on pads or do you place continious reinforced lintols on the windows and wall plate?

volcan357
  1/20/2017 20:45 EST

I have built several houses in Panama. Here we use a post and beam type of construction so the blocks act as a filler rather than give much support. I always use steel posts but you can make posts with concrete and rebar. In addition every two or three layers of block you use rebar horizontally welded from post to post. The building ends up being quite strong. In fact much stronger than typical US construction with studs and vinyl siding.

stgibson
  1/25/2017 15:07 EST

We used a steel skeletal frame with steel posts on 8' centers. We then filled in the walls with M2 welded wire and polystyrene panels and stuccoed over the inside and outside using a fiber mixture in the stucco. Extremely strong and flexible system and much faster than block. We experienced the strongest earthquake in 30 years with the epi-center 15KM away about 2 months after completion and not a crack anywhere. Panels are readily available here are are becomming more & more popular. http://en.mdue.it/

vulcan900
  1/28/2017 22:33 EST

Just from looking at pictures I don`t see any roof or soffit vents. So I was wondering now the roofs are vented?

stgibson
  1/30/2017 09:26 EST

We used 2x6 cariolas run vertically on 2' centers w/ vents in the soffits and at the ridge. We installed roll insulation under the tin and then 2" polystyrene in the bottom just below the sheetrock. It functions as a solar chimney and works very well at keeping the radiated heat out of the living space and also allows for vaulted ceilings through out the living area.

karlrobert
  2/4/2017 16:17 EST

not interested in u advertising 4 your boyfriend on this forum

Losuverous
  2/18/2017 21:31 EST

We have a home just outside Penonome please contact us at [email protected]
Been here in Panama for over 10 years.
Regards hazel

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Visa and Residency PanamaPanama Visa & Residency Guide

This article covers the ins and outs of the most common tourist and residency visas that expats and global nomads obtain when moving to and living in Panama.

10 Tips for Living in Panama10 Tips for Living in Panama

If you've recently arrived in Panama, here are 10 tips for digital nomads living in Panama.

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William Russell
William Russell

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