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guest user
3/17/2001 21:16 EST

" Hi! My name is Kathleen and I will be moving to Taif, SA to teach this coming Aug. I would appreciate any info you can give me about the locality, as well as the whole of Saudi and their treatment of Western women in particular. I will be living on a hospital compound. I am looking forward to going, even though, there are still some unanswered questions. Sometimes, I ask too many! BUT, a person has to be cautious. Any info, you can give me is appreciated! Kathleen "

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guest user
3/17/2001 21:19 EST

" Hi Kathleen. My name is Bob and I live in Jeddah, Saudi Arabia. Taif is located in the central western part of Saudi Arabia and is about a two hour drive from Jeddah. Taif is also located in the mountains. I have been in Saudi Arabia for one and a half years and have enjoyed being able to travel to different parts of the Kingdom. Saudi Arabia has a lot of history which most of the locals don''t care about. As far as your question on western women, it is a different world here. If you have not been told, women are not allowed to drive here (you will have to take a taxi or go in groups on a bus for travel), you have your own section in all restaurants (single men & women are kept separated), when women are out in public you have to wear an abyia over you western clothing. Within the compound where you will be living, if it is like most compounds, you can wear normal weatern clothing, etc. Religious items be careful. Do not wear anything that looks like a cross, etc., out in public. You could have it taken from you. This is strickly a Muslim country. Some people do date, behind closed doors. Don''t get caught out of your compound with a male. This can get both parties put in jail and sent out of the country. I''m not trying to scare you off from coming here, but think you should know what to expect. I sure others you will be associated with will be able to fill you in on everything. Good luck. My e-mail is 2stepbob@zajil.net. Would like to hear from you when you arrive or before that if you like. Bob "

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guest user
3/17/2001 21:31 EST

" Hi Kathleen, Sounds like you''re in for a real adventure. I live in Dhahran, in the Eastern Province - which is located on the shores of the Persian (actually, Arabian here) Gulf. So I''m on the other side of the country. I''ve lived & worked here for 8 years, and think it''s one of the ost fasscinating - and rewarding - experiences of a very interesting life. I read 2stepbob''s e-mail to you. He''s pretty much on the mark. You will have to keep at least your body covered in an abaya (which is like a sheer, losse-fitting cloak, although covering your hair may be unnecessary. The general premise here is that often it''s usually much easier to take some precautions which demonstrate courtesy to the local culture than to make a statement of individuality. Simply put, it''s easier to cover up than it is to face the hassles if you don''t. Teh first thng you want to do when you arrive is to register yourself at the US Embassy in Riyadh (I''m assuming you''re American). The number is: (01) 488-3800. Taif is a beautiful part of the country and, because it''s in the mountains, the air is quite a bit drier and cooler than it si in the Eastern Province. Winters are quite cool. Taif is also a favourite summertime haunt of the Saudi royal family. You''ll be surrounded by history - some of it dating back thousands of years. Lawrence of Arabia helped the locals blow up the country''s only railway line back during the Turkish occupation in the early part of this century. The twisted railway ties are still out there. Best way to travel here, from my experience, is to com ewith an open mind. You''ll be entering a culture that is unbelievably different than that of which you''re used to. You''ll see apparently wierd behaviour virtually every day. Try not to judge it by your evolved value system. Here, it may be perfectly normal behaviour. It''s human nature to try to explain everything by the most convenient method available - and usually that''s one which is well reinforced in the culture that you''ve grown up in. It won''t work here. This culture has eveolved in one of the harshest climates on earth, over thousands of years. Saudi Arabia was virtually cut off from the entire world between about the 1400''s and the early part of the 1900''s - almost 500 years! Once you see the climate and landscape of the place, you''ll have a better appreciation for why Eastern & Western traders sought any other route - like sailing around the bottom of Africa. The desert climate was a killer hundreds of years ago. So other cultures left the Arabian Peninsula pretty much alone. And the Saudi Culture evolved in a virtual vacuum for half a millennium. Now, does it surprise you that the custos, values, habits, and behaviours might be something that you can''t immediately relate to? Not! The Saudi people, especially as individuals, have numerous virutes and exceptional qualities. They''re very friendly, honest, helpful, and generous. The systems that operate here are chaotic and very inefficient. If you''re anal about time management and need to constantly feel ""in control"", you might have a frustrating adaptation. If, however, you easily go with the flow and have the patience to listen first, then you''ll discover some neat things about a world that relatively few people will ever explore. It''s definitely worthwhile. Alcohol, narcotics, pornography, and pork are very seriously prohibited. Possession of especially the first three can get you into unlimited trouble. Even the US Embassy & Consulate (there''s a Consulate in Jeddah) are hesitant to bail people out who have knowingly played that game. Rule #1 - ""Don''t get caught!"". Gold is relatively inexpensive, and it''s against the law to sell anything of less tha 18 carat purity. These laws are well obeyed, since the penalties according to Islam are rather direct and severe. The country, as far as I know, has very little crime - especially in the violent crime area. I''ve forgotten my wallet in a shopping cart in a Safeway store crowded with thousands of people, and come back 10 minutes later to pick it up. I generally always keep my house and car unlocked. It''s a pretty safe place. True enough, men and single women are segregated. I''m sure, however, that you''ll have ample opportunity to socialize on whatever terms. What''s interesting about this place is how people from various parts of the world adapt to their environment. You get some real eye-opening innovation. There''s a lot to explore while in Saudi Arabia, but you won''t be able to trael around alone very freely. Single women, for instance, can''t check into a hotel on their own. A good thing for you to do is ensure that you might get a multiple exit/re-entry visa while in-Kingdom. That will allow you to travel to other countries (Egypt, Europe, the Far East, for example) without having to submit your passport for lengthy visa processing. Saudi Arabia, at the moment, is 7 hours ahead of New York (timewise). Explore setting up a ""Kallback"" account. It''ll save you a mint n long-distance phonecalls. There are a numberof companies in the US which issue trigger numbers that you can call from Saudi Arabia. You let the phone ring once, hang up, and then it immediately calls you back with an open line to the US (or any other country). Calling long distance this way is the same as calling any country from the US, and not Saudi Arabia. It bypasses the Saudi telephone system (which, of course, they don''t like or conone) but the calls are about 2/3 cheaper. One such company is: Kallback, based in Redmond, WA. Their number is: (800) 959-5255. Make sure you know what currency you''re getting paid in in advance (e.g. US dollars, Saudi Arabian riyals, etc.). Also, if you can get the terms of your employement (as detailed as possible) on paper - so that you have a copy - it will be helpful. I don''t want to scare you but it''s not uncommon for professional people to go unpaid for 3-4 months at a time. It''s also not unheard of for people to sign one contract at home, and then be faced with an entirely different one once they get here. If they refuse, they fly home on thier own expense. I''m sure that''s not the rule but you do want to cover yourself IN ADVANCE. Most transactions here are done in cash. VISA, Mastercard, and AMEX is accepted in a lot of places but merchants will almost always try to levy their sevice charge onto you. If that happens, you can always call your card company and request an immediate credit to your account. If you qualify for an American Express Platinum card it''s worthwhile. They''re expensive ($300/year) but the services that they can provide you with (for example, a number that you can call ""collect"" for any number of reasons - even emergency help). I use up more than $300/year just on collect charges. If you''ve got some specific personal amenities that you have to have, consider bringing a stock of them. Supply on certan items is unpredictable here. Basic items, however, are no proble. All of the common toothpastes, shampoos, etc. are always available. Basically, most things are readily available. There is a limited selection of things like womes'' clothing (which may or may not suit your taste). But, hey, that''s on eof the things foreign travel is good for. And besides, it''s not as though you''re going to be dressing vogue for work every day. It rains in Taif at certain times of year, so don''t be surprised by a bit of weather. As for treatment of Western women, it''s remarkable varied. I''m a Western man, so I''m not an authority on the issue. I do, however, know far more Western women who have no problem whatsoever than women who get harassed a lot. I also know women who will go to town with the foxiest of outfits, and the foxiest of attitudes, and then wonder why they''re always being pestered. That''a a no-brainer! Again, most Saudis you''ll meet are very courteous and respectful - if you are yourself. Basically, a lot of people call negative experiences upon themselves - although there may be times when you''re totally minding your own business innocently and some mutawa (the religious fundamentalists) gets on your case. These are generally the huys with LDS (Little D*** Syndrome) that can''t be heard any other way. My overall advice is this - ask questions, but not too many. And never from those that haven''t a clue - only an opinion based on nothing. This place is most certainly different, but it''s also very interesting and it can offer a lot of learning opportunities that you''ll carry with you for the rest of your life. If you''ve got any specific questions, feel free to write back. Aloha, Peter Paunic "

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guest user
3/17/2001 21:35 EST

" Customs and Immigrations Been out of the airport in less then 30mintues from the time the wheels touched down to being there for over 5 hours. It will depend on when you are arriving and which planes got in ahead of you. (Air India or Pakistan - Relax you will be there awhile.) Searching, I have brought in Computer Disks, Movies, Books, etc. If the Movies are store brought in cartons then normally they will pass. I have not tried anything harder then a PG-13. Magazines depends on the officer you get. Try to separate your items into sections all magazines in one area, movies in another, etc. Then tell the man that you were informed about what not to bring to Saudi. Be honest. I have a couple officers go thru everything I was carrying (nothing taken) and other officers that while I was un-zipping the bag told me ''halas'' (finished). So roll the dice. If you are traveling with your wife and children - normally - you will be escorted to the ahead of the line. It has also happened to me when I was behind a large group of TCN''s. All got told to go to one line. Computer and disks, anything that has the illusion of sex in the title or packaging be warned. They will probably be taken, make sure you get the receipt for you items. As to any personal files on the machine. It depends again on who is the officer checking your luggage. I had my machine taken and checked on the spot and had all of my programs be sent to the customs office. When you land you will be pester by baggage handling people who will tell you a large amount. Do not pay more then $2.50 per bag (10 riyals and be firm.) I always tell the man that if he is good then I will tip him. (Normally three large bags and carry-on for Saudi Riyal 50.00 or about $13.50.) Try to get an Arabic tape and learn a few words. Hello, Thank you, God-Willing, Please, Good bye and Praise be to God. Show that you are trying to learn and fit in to the airport people and it helps. Wife doing teaching or researching, the best place to try is at one of the women universities. With a little help and time, she will be allowed to visit and use there facilities. Be warn, I hope you like tea and coffee, drinking tea will go along way in the Kingdom. If you have other questions e-mail me. maiseymt@aramco.com.sa Michael "

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