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Jade Helm

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crazyfarmer
  4/14/2015 11:54 EST

ok, USians, this is the official Jade Helm thread. At the very least, I think this is the prepositioning of assets. At worst, it won't end until it goes live while they continue to to call it a drill. What do we think about this?

Lots of friends going back for a visit now. :-/

http://www.thecommonsenseshow.com/2015/04/14/lt-col-caught-in-lies-about-jade-helm-our-worst-fears-confirmed/

Wanderlustspirit
  4/18/2015 01:11 EST

It is very disconcerting. I am even more concerned after reading the article at the link you provided. It all seems surreal. Another article that will ignite a chill down one's spine: http://www.infowars.com/jade-helm-troops-to-operate-undetected-amongst-civilian-population/

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crazyfarmer
  4/18/2015 20:03 EST

I see not many people are wanting to talk about what's going on up there. :-)

yeah, I'm very familiar with AJ. He currently has an article about a new air force base that appeared almost out of nowhere about 45 minutes south of Lubbock, TX, complete with surface to air missile batteries.

Then there's the crazy walmart closures and their ridiculous excuse. Maybe it's nothing. But why not just say why they're closing them?

Not sure what's up, but things are likely to get interesting up there "real soon now". It's definitely sureal. It's obvious strange things are happening, but difficult to impossible to know the big picture ahead of time.

The expats here talk about this stuff all the time. But the big questions no one can answer are when, how fast, and how bad. There's four or five bad scenarios you've probably already figured out. And it's hard to know if one or all of them will happen and in which order. The best you can do is take step back, look at all the crazy, and decide to watch the train wreck from a safe distance, which is what we've done.

MtnMan
  4/19/2015 06:11 EST

It's kind of what you'd expect up here right now: A small percentage see this madness and realize that something bad is most likely going on. The rest? Complacent as ever. I'm very concerned. Trying to get my family out of the USA, but it's hard on limited funds. Having said that, we'd rather be poor and free any day. Thanks for the insightful commentaries on this!

crazyfarmer
  4/19/2015 20:20 EST

We barely scraped by getting all of us down here. I'm not sure how we could have done it with less money, but I see people trying.

Up there where we were, I'd say it was about 90/10, with 10% of the people I met paying attention and 90% oblivious. Down here in the expat community, it's the other way around with varying degrees of awakeness mixed with some crazy. The 10% mostly work for the embassy or the US state department. The locals are almost 100% unaware of what's happening, which is sort of what I would expect.

I fully expect a "big event" up there, followed by 1000 questions from the locals I see every day asking what happened and why.

Tarshatha
  4/20/2015 09:13 EST

Caught On Tape: National Guard Troops Patrol California City, Conduct New Jersey "Homeland Response Drill"

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-04-18/caught-tape-national-guard-troops-patrol-california-city-conduct-new-jersey-homeland

Signs That 'The Elites' Are Feverishly Preparing For Something Big

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-04-16/signs-elites-are-feverishly-preparing-something-big

The scariest thing about the above article is the New York Fed moving to Chicago. It reminds me of when Obama said a nuke could go off in NY City. (Can't say they weren't warned)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YD9-2_RTtp8

Personally I think it's one big conditioning exercise, for both citizens and military to prepare people for the coming of full out marshal law, or shelter in place as like to refer to it nowadays.

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crazyfarmer
  4/21/2015 13:52 EST

http://www.thecommonsenseshow.com/2015/04/21/under-jade-helm-canadian-troops-will-help-enforce-martial-law-on-americans/

MtnMan
  4/22/2015 05:22 EST

Yeah, I live about 50 miles from Ontario, California where the National Guard was marching down the streets. I've got to say that I'm happily surprised that more people are angry about it than I thought would be. My wife and I are Liberals and we also support gun ownership rights. (Most of the Tea Party folks up here can't wrap their heads around that.) We want to get the Hell out because of our concerns over the right wing big religion/big business madness that's growing like a cancer here in our Constitutional republic. I'll be damned if I let those bastard Dominionist fascists like Ted Cruz turn my granddaughters into broodmares for Republican Jesus. NOT ON MY WATCH! One of my best friends is Libertarian. He and I disagree on a lot, but we both see that the storm is coming. My wife and I are both entrepeneurs, so with that background we think we stand a better chance than a lot of people do at adapting to a new culture. I hope we're right. It's Germany in the 1930's in the USA right now, but sadly, not enough folks see that yet.

LETSC
  4/22/2015 09:25 EST

something is cooking and not good

afj21
  4/23/2015 11:44 EST

Be Prepared, the Boy Scout motto. I served in two branches of military and have been employed by the U.S. Govt for 15 years. When you run drills you learn where your weaknesses lie. I see nothing wrong with this. The sky is not falling. These type of drills are well over due.

Wanderlustspirit
  4/23/2015 21:22 EST

"We want to get the Hell out because of our concerns over the right wing big religion/big business madness that's growing like a cancer here in our Constitutional republic. I'll be damned if I let those bastard Dominionist fascists like Ted Cruz turn my granddaughters into broodmares for Republican Jesus."

Wow, it seems you are suffering from the delusion of being "well-informed" when in actuality, your comments show a complete ignorance of what is happening in the U.S. If you want to know what really is going on, you should be reading The Wall Strret Journal, Drudge Report & other cities' newspapers (Moscow Times, The Daily Telegraph, etc.).

Then you might learn that George Soros' money is actively funding the civil unrest in our nation & repeating inaccuracies to gin up animosity. You also would learn that more businesses have shut with Obama at the helm & new business start ups are at an all-time low in our nation. You need to step away from the Kool aid, turn off the propaganda being espoused by main stream media & do your research on what is going on.

Christians are being persecuted in America & it will worsen if the Supreme Court rules in favor of same sex marriages. Then the Liberal, community activist will show up at churches Demanding the pastors' perform the ceremony. You honestly need to wake up & look carefully at who is actively eroding our liberties & refusing to call out Islamist for their massacre over the past few years of hundreds of thousands of Christians.

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crazyfarmer
  4/24/2015 12:27 EST

you go girl. lol

MtnMan
  4/26/2015 08:50 EST

Well wanderlustspirit, I have a very different take on that, but to each their own. :-) Not looking to argue, but I'll say this much. Christian dominionists are the ones who'll be doing the persecuting. As far as the evangelical whiners up here who love to scream "We're persecuted", my response is "Tell the familes whose relatives were murdered by ISIS about yer persecution over wedding cakes in the States and see how far that gets you when talking to them". America is turning into a Christian fascist theocracy (barring a miracle) and like I said before, I'm not letting those freaks turn my granddaughters into broodmares for Republican Jesus.

MtnMan
  4/26/2015 08:53 EST

Wanderlustspirit, because I come to a different conclusion than yours doesn't mean I'm not informed or that I haven't been doing my homework. You don't know me and you don't know my background with these nutjobs, yet you assume that I'm unaware of what's going on up here. Oh, well. That's fine. Anyway, I wish you well! Best regards! :-)

MtnMan
  4/26/2015 08:56 EST

afj21, I tend to agree with you. I'm a Vet as well. Thank you for your service! I'm just keeping a watchful eye on Jade Helm. Can't hurt! Have a good one. Best regards!

MtnMan
  4/26/2015 08:59 EST

wnaderlust spirit, Dominoinst bastards in Congress and many State legislatures are doing their utmost to turn this Constituional republic into a theocracy. That was never want the founders intended. If they'd wanted a theocracy in the USA, they'd have established one from the git-go. https://crookedcrosses.wordpress.com

MtnMan
  4/26/2015 09:01 EST

wanderlustspirit: http://churchandstate.org.uk/2013/02/christian-fundamentalists-are-driving-our-country-into-the-dark-ages/

carlitos
  4/26/2015 13:19 EST

I don't understand why some people are so upset when it comes to same sex marriage, amazingly those people are upset too against abortion and they need to believe in fantasies. Really costs a ton to understand these people, we are living in the 21 century, we have nano technology and we now know that a black, or a gay are the same fricking people as a christian or Muslim, made out of the same genetics. We would have to be worried about real problems as pollution, and wars not about who marries who.

kimbo47
  4/26/2015 15:05 EST

Its not only the funds but also in finding a place that will suit you and your family and then going through the maze of requirements to get a residence assuming you qualify.

MtnMan
  4/26/2015 18:00 EST

Hi Carlitos,

I agree with the points you made. Hopefully, Uruguay will remain a country that respects people's right to live as they choose. Our family has done a lot of homework and uruguay seems like the best bet. if we can't move to uruguay, we're thinking of Ecuador as a 2nd choice. Still doing more research.

Wanderlustspirit
  4/26/2015 19:19 EST

MtMan - the Nazification of America is well underway, primarily attributable to the Democratic Party. http://endoftheamericandream.com/archives/20-signs-that-the-nazification-of-america-is-almost-complete

Surprised you aren't celebrating & reveling in the "Hope & Change" delivered by the consummate Liberal, Obama.

MtnMan
  4/26/2015 19:26 EST

Thanks for your view on things up here, Wanderlustspirit.
Best regards!

carlitos
  4/26/2015 19:55 EST

Ecuador is different, very different, and is nice too. I tried to live in Ecuador but couldn't find a job but I liked the country, specially Quito.

crazyfarmer
  4/26/2015 20:48 EST

>Christian dominionists

What does this mean? Never heard of it.

> are the ones who'll be doing the persecuting.

I think the vast majority of christians aren't persecuting anyone and never will. But there are definitely fringe groups who cause problems.

> As far as the evangelical whiners up here who love to scream
>"We're persecuted",

As an evangelical whiner, let me say that the persecution is definitely ramping up in the US. Want to see how? Try working in a gay bakery and refusing to make cakes for christian weddings and see how fast you don't get shut down. The double standards are out of control. And this is how it starts. There's definitely a downward trend. And it's where it's obviously heading that has a lot of us concerned, not so much where it is today.

> my response is "Tell the familes whose relatives were murdered
>by ISIS about yer persecution over wedding cakes in the States
> and see how far that gets you when talking to them".

What we're experiencing in the US is of course nothing like what the coptic and syrian christians are enduring today which you point out. But I think it's reasonable to complain about the directions things are heading before our families are rounded up and executed.

ISIS by the way was created by and is indirectly operated by the CIA.

>America is turning into a Christian fascist theocracy (barring a
>miracle) and like I said before, I'm not letting those freaks turn my
>granddaughters into

I agree that the US is turning into a fascist state (fascist at the top, communist at the bottom), but it has nothing to do with Christianity. And it's definitely not a theocracy.

> broodmares for Republican Jesus.

Jesus has nothing to do with the republicans or any other political party. But many politicians abuse Jesus and Christianity in the hopes of getting Christians to vote for them. Unfortunately many are clueless and fall for this. Just because a politician claims to be a Christian, it doesn't mean he is, right?

You're political views are interesting and definitely not what most people (who see what's happening) are saying. What sites are you reading and what part of the country do you come from?

brian

crazyfarmer
  4/26/2015 20:58 EST

>I don't understand why some people are so upset when it comes
> to same sex marriage,

There's an obvious trend in the US to the idea of the family. The idea is that the state owns your children. And if people aren't forming strong family units, then they're easier to subjugate and control because they have nothing to fight for. The promotion of same sex marriage is part of this agenda. If you're gay, you're not reproducing.

Not sure how it is here (actually I am, it's the same, just not as advanced), but in the US, they shove the gay agenda down our throats. There's news articles every week up there talking about how they're teaching anal sex to 6 year olds, or forcing children to learn about transgender rights. Thanks, but I'd prefer to maintain control over that kind of thing.

Personally, I think the government should butt out of marriage of any kind. Why do I need to get the state's permission to get married?

>amazingly those people are upset too against
>abortion

Yep. I believe it's nothing less than murder in order to enable a life style choice.

>and they need to believe in fantasies.

???

>Really costs a ton to understand these people, we are living in
>the 21 century, we have nano technology

Not all technology is used for good.

>and we now know that a black, or a gay are the
>same fricking people as a christian or Muslim, made out of the
> same genetics.

Gay isn't genetic, it's a lifestyle choice. And I'd prefer that the state not force it's opinions about gays on my children.

Religion is another unrelated subject.

>We would have to be worried about real problems as
>pollution, and wars not about who marries who.

Agreed. But most people who think they understand those subjects really don't.

brian

Wanderlustspirit
  4/26/2015 21:13 EST

Crazy farmer - MtnMan is a liberal from CA. Like many states run by liberals in the U.S., they incur such significant amounts of debt, they regulate anything & everything they can, not only to expand the size of the government but also to increase the government's revenue. Through these policies, businesses are driven out/leave for more favorable operating environments & people flee for more affordable places to live outside of the state.

This pattern will continue to repeat itself because in liberals' eyes, the government can never be too large or the debt too high. It's all relative.

Ask Detroit how that is working out for them or even Chicago. I would love to see the government officials that spent money STOLEN from the hard-working, government-employees of that city, have to deliver the news to those people that they will have NOTHING for their retirement due to the greed & lack of fiscal discipline shown by their city's leaders. Makes me sick to my stomach & it have empathy for these employees that have been robbed.

Wanderlustspirit
  4/26/2015 21:13 EST

Crazy farmer - MtnMan is a liberal from CA. Like many states run by liberals in the U.S., they incur such significant amounts of debt, they regulate anything & everything they can, not only to expand the size of the government but also to increase the government's revenue. Through these policies, businesses are driven out/leave for more favorable operating environments & people flee for more affordable places to live outside of the state.

This pattern will continue to repeat itself because in liberals' eyes, the government can never be too large or the debt too high. It's all relative.

Ask Detroit how that is working out for them or even Chicago. I would love to see the government officials that spent money STOLEN from the hard-working, government-employees of that city, have to deliver the news to those people that they will have NOTHING for their retirement due to the greed & lack of fiscal discipline shown by their city's leaders. Makes me sick to my stomach & it have empathy for these employees that have been robbed.

crazyfarmer
  4/26/2015 21:28 EST

>Crazy farmer - MtnMan is a liberal from CA.

Land of the fruits and nuts. I grew up in the Los Angeles area by the way. :-)

> Like many states run by liberals in the U.S., they incur such
>significant amounts of debt, they regulate anything & everything
>they can, not only to expand the size of the government but also
>to increase the government's revenue. Through these policies,
>businesses are driven out/leave for more favorable operating
>environments & people flee for more affordable places to live
>outside of the state.

Uruguay is also very much a "worker's paradise" and following this model to the letter. The socialists recently won again also. So I expect them to continue down the same path.

But don't worry! When the world-wide economic collapse comes, the government will be there to save us all!


>This pattern will continue to repeat itself because in liberals'
>eyes, the government can never be too large or the debt too high.
>It's all relative.

Socialism: We can't all be rich, so let's all be equally poor! Except for our leaders. They get to be rich.

>Ask Detroit how that is working out for them or even Chicago.

Detroit is a model for the rest of the US. Did you see how they removed the elected government there and appointed whoever they wanted?

>I would love to see the government officials that spent money
>STOLEN from the hard-working, government-employees of that
>city, have to deliver the news to those people that they will have
>NOTHING for their retirement due to the greed & lack of fiscal
>discipline shown by their city's leaders. Makes me sick to my
>stomach & it have empathy for these employees that have been
>robbed.

Don't worry. We can always print more dollars.

brian

MtnMan
  4/26/2015 22:00 EST

Hi Brian,

Here are some links to information about Dominionism from both Christian and 'secular' sources:

Here's an Evangelical Pastpr explaining it: 'What is Dominionism and the Church by Pastor Chris Quintana Calvary Chapel Cypress': https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QwKafNU3ZsA

'NAR "Apostle C. Peter Wagner teaching its key doctrine of Dominionism': https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7WboWrp-Cwo

'Dominionism Theocracy, New Apostolic Reformation & Rick Perry': https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cHlQteTp5c8

LOTS of information here: 'Crooked Crosses': https://crookedcrosses.wordpress.com/tag/dominionism/

'The rise of Dominionism' from Cornell University's 'Theocracy Watch' (This was done back in 2004. Things are a lot worse now): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ok3ZaTH1K1E

'Life and Liberty for All Who Believe' (produced in the early 80's): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=is_fhyhbAa4&list=PLgmJ01MBpYo76TNeVptjM88VI_aYIKxS1

'Moyers Interviews Rousas J. Rushdoony - 1988' (Rushdoony is the father of the modern Christian Reconstructionist movement): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=paL2s4HJScg&list=PLgmJ01MBpYo76TNeVptjM88VI_aYIKxS1

'Beware the Tea Party Dominionists: Chris Hedges State of Belief Radio Interview October 12, 2013': https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iH6h3279_QU

'John MacArthur speak about NAR': https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2CeW4Itv5Wc

'RWW News: Rafael Cruz (Ted Cruz's father) Preaches 7 Mountains Dominionism': https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLMNkzvae4M

Best regards!

MtnMan
  4/26/2015 22:04 EST

>Crazy farmer - MtnMan is a liberal from CA

Whoa there. I'm from the midwest. I *now* live in California. I'm a liberal on *some, not all issues*. I support the 2nd Amendment, for example. You give some great ad hominems and straw man arguments, apparently to discredit what I say. Why am I not surprised? LOL

MtnMan
  4/26/2015 22:08 EST

'Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please.'
- Mark Twain

MtnMan
  4/26/2015 22:09 EST

I didn't mean for this to become a big argument. Sorry, folks.
Best regards to all here.

MtnMan
  4/26/2015 22:40 EST

'The Rise of the Religious Right in the Republican Party'

http://theocracywatch.org/

This is an EXCELLENT resource site from Cornell University's Theocracy Watch project.

Tarshatha
  4/27/2015 08:34 EST

Crazyfarmer,

thanks for the link. I'm a proud Canadian but very disappointed in my government's willingness to follow and participate blindly in a lot this US lead aggression.

Regards,

Paul

crazyfarmer
  4/27/2015 12:32 EST

MtnMan -

I'm working a lot today. I'll try to get to your links tonight.

But I can assure you that while some people in the US might love the idea of a christian theocracy, it will never happen. My gut feeling here is that this is just another way of attacking christians who are trying to prevent moral depravity and the downward trend toward christian persecution.

The socialist gay/transgender agenda is definitely winning in the US, not the christians.

Anyway, we're getting off track. If we fight each other, then we can't team up and fight the people who are really trying to enslave us all. And that's what this is really all about.

brian

afj21
  4/27/2015 14:13 EST

Thanks MtnMan...

I don't "buy-in" to every conspiracy theory that is dreamed up by some podunk anti-american website and more often than not I am finding that the people who haven't actually served our country in any capacity are the ones who spew forth this type of ridiculous rubbish.

I mean, if you're going to leave the USA with your guns and bury your money in the back yard than forge ahead to new things and stop worrying about what goes on there.

MtnMan
  4/27/2015 15:23 EST

> Anyway, we're getting off track. If we fight each other, then we can't team up and fight the people who are really trying to enslave us all. And that's what this is really all about.

AGREED! :-)

Best regards to you and yours, Brian. :-)

MtnMan
  4/27/2015 15:23 EST

> Anyway, we're getting off track. If we fight each other, then we can't team up and fight the people who are really trying to enslave us all. And that's what this is really all about.

AGREED! :-)

Best regards to you and yours, Brian. :-)

crazyfarmer
  4/27/2015 18:52 EST

>I don't "buy-in" to every conspiracy theory that is dreamed up

Neither do I.

>by some podunk anti-american website

What does it mean to be anti-american? If you disagree with your government, are you anti-american? Many americans would say so.

>and more often than not I am finding that the people who haven't
>actually served our country in any capacity are the ones who
>spew forth this type of ridiculous rubbish.

Why would people who disagree with the government serve the government? Does not serving your country make you unable to recognize tyranny when you see it?

In fact, when I talk with people who were in the military, I wonder whether or not the military brainwashing has anything to do with their current world view.

I have a lot of respect for someone who takes up arms to defend their country. Nothing is more honorable. But I ask you, what are we defending? The US homeland or poppy fields in Afghanistan?

I think the vast majority of the people serving our country haven't the faintest idea what they're actually serving. Go read "War is a Racket" by General Smedley Butler and get back to me.

>I mean, if you're going to leave the USA with your guns and bury
>your money in the back yard than forge ahead to new things and
>stop worrying about what goes on there.

What goes on there affects the entire world.

brian

LinLu
  4/28/2015 17:53 EST

Reading from afar, but soon to be part of the Uruguayan scene, I'm surprised at the volatility of this forum sometimes.

I truly thought that the balanced or ideal goal of the United States was to allow for freedom of religion, not just freedom of Christianity. Therein lies the problem.

The situation with gay rights stems from the fact that some choose it and some were born that way. But as a minister, I can assure you that the "gay agenda" has had absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the breakdown of the family. That has come in large part from within the family units themselves. Infidelity, separate careers, children left in day care centers raised by others, exhaustion and little time for cultivating relationships, and not caring for the deep spiritual needs that everyone has, have created the breakdown of the family.

Having been in a committed relationship myself for the past 24 years, and having counseled dozens of couples -- gay and straight -- I can state with authority that the cause of the breakdown of the family is not caused by gays. However, the rejection of Christianity by many has come because those who call themselves by the name, live like they were on a mission to "purge the devil" out of everyone singlehandedly -- no love -- no compassion -- no desire for healing in relationships -- just a wielding of their opinion as the only possible correct way to view things. Sort of seeing everone that doesn't agree with them as the "enemy"!

So, if we approach the "persecution" thing as something that is a consequence of lack of love and genuine expression of compassionate kingdom living on earth, it makes more sense.

Using the Bible as a weapon of choice by interpretation is such a shame and so damaging if the goal is to bring about a world guided into peace through a living demonstration of God's love -- not anger and destruction. This includes handling our conversations about misguided (I don't care by whom) ISIS folks, anti-gay folks, pro-life folks, anti-abortion folks, Christians, Republicans, Democrats, liberals and conservatives and anyone else who you feel needs a label, with even greater civility, greater love, and greater attempts to understand each other and where we're all coming from.

Just a few thoughts. Perhaps spending more time discussing how to live a life of greater love, and passionate faith in the face of our present world situation, would yield a different and much better world.

It would certainly lower blood pressures!

crazyfarmer
  4/28/2015 23:11 EST

>I truly thought that the balanced or ideal goal of the United States
>was to allow for freedom of religion, not just freedom of
>Christianity. Therein lies the problem.

There's freedom of religion in the US for every religion except Christianity.

>The situation with gay rights stems from the fact that some
>choose it and some were born that way.

I disagree. I believe they all choose it, since people are responsible for their actions.

>But as a minister, I can assure you that the "gay agenda" has had
>absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the breakdown of the
>family.

I disagree. I believe the promotion of homosexuality, and other forms of depravity, is part of a larger anti-family agenda.

>That has come in large part from within the family units
>themselves. Infidelity,

The other things you list are certainly destroying the family as well. But it doesn't mean that the gay agenda isn't contributing to this.

> separate careers,

Feminism and women with careers was also a social agenda paid for and promoted by the Rockefellers. They wanted to get women into the workforce for a variety of reasons. It would increase the taxes collected, increase consumerism, drive down wages, and contribute to the destruction of the family.

>children left in day care centers raised by others, exhaustion and
>little time for cultivating relationships, and not caring for the deep
>spiritual needs that everyone has, have created the breakdown
>of the family.

All symptoms of the same problem

>Having been in a committed relationship myself for the past 24
>years, and having counseled dozens of couples -- gay and
>straight -- I can state with authority that the cause of the
>breakdown of the family is not caused by gays.

Homosexuality is as old as humanity itself. It's not the individual gays that are causing the breakdown of the family, rather the forces that are moving society to accept that lifestyle as normal.

>However, the rejection of Christianity by many has come
>because those who call themselves by the name, live like they
>were on a mission to "purge the devil" out of everyone
>singlehandedly -- no love -- no compassion -- no desire for
>healing in relationships -- just a wielding of their opinion as the
>only possible correct way to view things. Sort of seeing everone
>that doesn't agree with them as the "enemy"!

I have no problems with "hate the sin and not the sinner". But I think the Bible is obviously clear on the matter. So it's not exactly my opinion I'm wielding here.

Let me stop for a minute and say that I'm not overtly mean to gays. I don't even call them out for it. I simply make an attempt to share the gospel (like I do with everyone) and hope that this will lead to them choosing a healthier (physically and spiritually) lifestyle. I resent the subtle notion here that I'm persecuting gays because I disapprove of their lifestyle.

>So, if we approach the "persecution" thing as something that is a
>consequence of lack of love and genuine expression of
>compassionate kingdom living on earth, it makes more sense.

Persecution exists because dark forces want Christians dead. They're not trying to kill us because we don't love gays enough. They're trying to kill us in an attempt to derail God's plan.

>Using the Bible as a weapon of choice by interpretation is such a
>shame and so damaging if the goal is to bring about a world
>guided into peace through a living demonstration of God's love --

The goal is to lead people to salvation through faith in Jesus Christ. And the best way to do that is to shine light on the dark places. And there's no better light than the word of God.

>not anger and destruction. This includes handling our
>conversations about misguided (I don't care by whom) ISIS folks,
>anti-gay folks, pro-life folks, anti-abortion folks, Christians,
>Republicans, Democrats, liberals and conservatives and anyone
>else who you feel needs a label, with even greater civility, greater
>love, and greater attempts to understand each other and where
>we're all coming from.

So if we just love the ISIS fighters more, then they'll stop killing Christians?

If you only knew who's really controlling ISIS.

>Just a few thoughts. Perhaps spending more time discussing
>how to live a life of greater love, and passionate faith in the face
>of our present world situation, would yield a different and much
>better world.

I think you need to spend more time reading your Bible. Make sure you use a good translation.

>It would certainly lower blood pressures!

From one Christian to another: Your message is dangerous. Stop it.

brian

Tarshatha
  4/29/2015 09:48 EST

Crazy Farmer,

Check out this comercial,

"2015 New AARP Commercial Announces Martial Law Declared!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5VdPyusbbCA

Notice at the 44 second mark the helm to the right of the picture? Loads of Jade or green throughout the commercial.
The subliminal message is beyond creepy.

Regards

paul

Flyingbluejay
  4/29/2015 13:13 EST

Dear Brian,

Greetings. What a thoughtful, measured response to human viewpoint thinking.

Thank you for taking the time to go through the post point-by-point.

As a believer, I personally find it marvelous to have the word of God as a guidepost, a compass to bring clarity to life's situations. The answer to darkness is the light. Christ Jesus is that Light.

For God so loved the world that He gave His uniquely born Son that whosoever believeth on Him shall not perish, but have eternal life. John 3:16

Your contributions to this site are appreciated.

Regards

crazyfarmer
  4/29/2015 20:53 EST

Tarshatha , I saw that. Totally bizarre. The weird thing is that they had to manufacture that radio clip in the background specifically for the commercial.

So... what? Are we supposed to associate martial law with being taken care of by mommy or something?

afj21
  4/29/2015 22:52 EST

Subliminal messages!!!

Bwaahahahaha!!!!!

crazyfarmer
  4/30/2015 12:00 EST

ok afj21, give me an alternate explanation for why they would hand craft that message to play on the radio in the background of a warm fuzzy commercial.

Nothing says "the loving care of mom" like martial law.

crazyfarmer
  4/30/2015 15:39 EST

lol

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10152918849581896&set=a.10151062044846896.428708.751511895&type=1

LovetheBeach
  5/7/2015 00:26 EST

MtnMan,

You might want to take Ecuador off your list as a possible place to relocate. You may be "from" the Midwest, but you have been steeped in Calif. liberalism long enough to have that particular stain pretty much attached to you. I know. I spent most of my life in southern Calif. and it started becoming "very broken" in the early 1990s. The first big recession happened then, and the state has never recovered, and now probably never will. As soon as the Liberals took control, everything went to hell in a hand basket. I still have a few family and friends in Calif., and most of them are looking for places to relocate to. I live now in Ecuador, in an Ecuadorian community, not a gringo community, and most of my friends are Ecuadorian. I think I have pretty good insight into what Ecuadorians believe and value. Because it is such a heavily Catholic country, and given your political and anti-Christian views, you and your family may not feel very comfortable here. There are quite a number of North American expats here, but the latest statistics still place us at less than 1% of the total population. Since the vast majority of the population believe abortion to be tantamount to murder, and that the gay lifestyle and gay behavior are mortal sins, the few gays that do come here pretty much have to fly totally under the radar. You may find it very difficult here. There are probably more gringo gays in Cuenca than any other city in Ecuador, and quite a few gringo anti-Christians, too, so if you decide to come to Ecuador, you may feel more comfortable there. You'd still be very much in the minority however, and may find it difficult to integrate into Ecuadorian life. Though, many gringos have no intention of integrating, so that may not be an issue for you. Just a word of caution, nothing more.

afj21
  5/8/2015 19:51 EST

CrazyFarmer,

I didn't mean to be disrespectful. I just think the comment was ridiculous. Believe what you want and I know you will, but I'm not one to buy into secret subliminal messages in commercials.

People see what they want to see.

MtnMan
  5/9/2015 11:11 EST

>>You might want to take Ecuador off your list as a possible place to relocate.

OK.

>>You may be "from" the Midwest, but you have been steeped in Calif. liberalism long enough to have that particular stain pretty much attached to you.

Oh for Pete's sake. You sound as if all Californians are alike. You know where I got some liberalsim? From using my VA Healthcare. I had been told for years by fellow conservatives that the Gov't could't do medicine well. Funny thing, the VA saved my life. That's when I started opening my eyes. You see, I'm a FORMER conservative, and it wasn't being in California that opened my eyes.

>>I know.

No, you don't.

>>I spent most of my life in southern Calif. and it started becoming "very broken" in the early 1990s.

Then you should nthat we're not all the same, You should know that the REICH wing is very big down here in SoCal. We're infested with many (NOT ALL) evangelicals who see it as their duty to lead by politics istead of by example. We're chock full of so called 'patriots' who are hell bent on telling everyone else how to live becuse they believe they have a mandate to 'restore' the USA to 'righteousness'.

>>The first big recession happened then, and the state has never recovered, and now probably never will. As soon as the Liberals took control, everything went to hell in a hand basket.

Yes, of course. The evil liberals destroyed everything. You go with that story. I'll stick to reality seenig as I'm HERE and might just know a thing or ten about where I live.

>>I still have a few family and friends in Calif., and most of them are looking for places to relocate to.

Actually, we'd love to stay here, but living in an evangelical fascist theocracy is not on our "to do" list.

>>I live now in Ecuador, in an Ecuadorian community, not a gringo community, and most of my friends are Ecuadorian. I think I have pretty good insight into what Ecuadorians believe and value. Because it is such a heavily Catholic country, and given your political and anti-Christian views, you and your family may not feel very comfortable here.

>>We're very good at practicing "Live and let live", thanks very much. We have quite a few Christian friends here, and we're CLOSE friends with most of them.

>>There are quite a number of North American expats here, but the latest statistics still place us at less than 1% of the total population. Since the vast majority of the population believe abortion to be tantamount to murder, and that the gay lifestyle and gay behavior are mortal sins, the few gays that do come here pretty much have to fly totally under the radar. You may find it very difficult here. There are probably more gringo gays in Cuenca than any other city in Ecuador, and quite a few gringo anti-Christians, too, so if you decide to come to Ecuador, you may feel more comfortable there. You'd still be very much in the minority however, and may find it difficult to integrate into Ecuadorian life. Though, many gringos have no intention of integrating, so that may not be an issue for you. Just a word of caution, nothing more.

A word of caution? Please. WHat you did was make ridiculous assumptions about my family and I. That's your right to do so, but don't expect me to listen to you tell me about myself and my family without getting a response.

I wonder, whe you make such assumptions about people you've never met, like myself... how is it that you take your assumptions seriously? You don't know me. Your example perfectly illustrates the mindset of today's right wing in the USA: You know it all, and you know others better than they know themselves. Riiiiiight.

MtnMan
  5/9/2015 11:13 EST

We're very good at practicing "Live and let live", thanks very much. We have quite a few Christian friends here, and we're CLOSE friends with most of them.

Wanderlustspirit
  5/9/2015 12:52 EST

MtMan - you were the one who identified yourself as a liberal in one of the first posts you made & then came out with harsh words towards Christians. I honestly don't understand how you can not see the persecution happening to Christians by the liberals in the U.S.

However I have found that many people do not see what they do not wish to see. Incidentally, it is the liberals in the U.S. That want to dictate how people can live. Down to telling us how large a soda can be bought in the U.S. ((Bloomberg).

You may not understand how you have come off to other's on this post but your rant about some leftist view embellishment in an effort to demonize Christians was extremely off putting.

If you dislike Cristians so strongly then you honestly should look into a Communist nation, like China, where churches are being destroyed & Christians are being driven out. Or you can hang out in America & many of the Communist strategies (the perestroika deception) will be evident within 3-6 months. I would encourage you to open your eyes & try to remove your bias just long enough to see what is happening under the current Administration to harm Christianity in our nation. The Supreme Court's same Sex marriage ruling (due soon) will open the door for pastors' & churches to be persecuted for "hate crimes" for not performing same sex marriages. Obama's budget called for churches to lose their tax exempt status which will push them out of service as they could never pay corporate tax rates on their "earnings". Churches have been audited at the highest rate ever in the history of the IRS. I did 5 consignment sales 2 years ago that benefitted the church's play schools. Out of those 5, at least 3 were being audited for the first time in hundreds of years that the church had been in existence. Obamacare regulations are forcing Christian groups to have to provide $ for birth control & abortions. Little Sisters of the Poor are being sued by our government for their religious beliefs.

So when you come on this blog, with people that feel forced to leave the only nation & home they have ever known due in part to REAL religious persecution happening TODAY to them & try to make the PERSECUTED the enemy, it is reminiscent of the Nazis blaming the Jews for their problems. So when your post is met with anger, disbelief & outright disagreement, then maybe you will get a clue why your prior post/self-identification sets people off.

Wanderlustspirit
  5/9/2015 13:05 EST

If you, MtMan, wish to see the persecution of Christians escalate dramatically, stay in the U.S. & see it first-hand. You can cheer as your Christtian friends are mocked (already actively occurring), lose their jobs (already occurring), receive additional attention from the IRS (already occurring), have their churches burned (already occurring), have their children taken from them (few cases of this occurring with home school families & refusal for treatment due to religious reasons), imprisoned (not a stretch with the direction of our nation, lose their life savings (already occurring), etc. you can be there to cheer as these "Fascist Christian theocracy" is expunged from the U.S. By the Liberal/communist leaders in the U.S.

If you think the U.S. & the world is dark now, you wait & see what it will be like when all the LIGHT (God's people) is extinguished.

I just can't stand ignorance & self-righteous hypocrisy. Sorry. I will pray for your eyes to be opened. Regardless, I agree with the other person that you should avoid Vhristian nations overall. There has been a revival in faith in Latin American nations so these may not be a good choice for someone who believes Christians are the source of evil in this world.

Wanderlustspirit
  5/9/2015 13:26 EST

"We want to get the Hell out because of our concerns over the right wing big religion/big business madness that's growing like a cancer here in our Constitutional republic. I'll be damned if I let those bastard Dominionist fascists like Ted Cruz turn my granddaughters into broodmares for Republican Jesus. NOT ON MY WATCH! " - MtMan

Hey Mr. "Live & let live" guy, read your words & see how well that matches up with your self-proclaimed mantra. I am calling out the hypocrisy. Also, go back & look at this thread prior to your first post. There is no blame or anger. You injected it into this thread.

Tarshatha
  5/18/2015 22:25 EST

Crazy Farmer,
I think it's a subtle suggestion that "you're weak, you're old, you've taken care of us (the government) and now we the Government will take care of you. Don't fight, don't resist..... very creepy though.

plantsandplaster
  1/1/2016 04:10 EST

Somehow in researching about UY on this forum I have been side tracked by a thread that is nothing but an all in virtual brawl between right wing Christians and a not so right wing semi-liberal. Both sides originating in USA, both sides disillusioned with the current direction their home country is heading, and both sides blaming each other for the catastrophe which they believe is going to befall this major world power. In spite of the heated rhetoric I know these are good people because they are willing to help others. As I stated in an earlier post I am a socialist and now after reading a few threads I have become aware that many US citizens have no understanding of what is meant by socialism nor do they understand the numerous benefits that are directly and indirectly garnered by a society that holds to a strong Social Welfare system as the underlying tenet of their Governments policy making, an example being that each individual has a sense of inclusiveness within their society and with that a strong feeling of pride in the justness of that society.
In another thread one of the “combatants” wrote that when people are scared they do not think clearly. It is understandable that a fear of death makes a person embrace a religion. It is understandable that a fear of eternal damnation makes a person hold true to his faith. It is also understandable that the fear of a church dictating how people should live their lives makes people turn away from theism. Without these fears and with clearness of thought an individual may not necessarily have such a mind set (or such a set mind).
To extend the analogy used in a previous post of the USA being a sinking ship; it seems that both sides have a common interest in using Uruguay as lifeboat. I hope that every expat looks to enhance the community that are now a part of. Perhaps if people can put to one side the desire to solely look after ‘number one’ (and yes this does mean conduct themselves like a socialist) they, their children or their children’s children may not see the need to look for a lifeboat in the future.
Bruce

letsmove
  1/1/2016 10:37 EST

The whole purpose and goal of the corporate media is to create friction. Divide and conquer. They are so clever at it. Sadly, it is working too well.

LovetheBeach
  1/1/2016 10:48 EST

Bruce, aka plantsandplaster:
Poppycock!! You obviously have absolutely no understanding of either Christianity or of socialism. All you have to do is take a look at Sweden. It's a mess. I know. I have a very dear friend who immigrated from Sweden to the U.S. to escape socialism, only to find 20 years later that the U.S. is following in the footsteps of a nation on the brink of total societal failure. Socialism likes to paint itself as a sort of "Robin Hood" who steals from the rich to give to the poor. In reality, socialism steals from anyone who has managed to work hard and save and invest wisely, in order to pay for the indolence of alcoholics, druggies, insurance fraudsters, and others who refuse to work, all the while whining and complaining about how mistreated they are.
Christianity teaches that we take care of those who are UNABLE to care for themselves, not those who are so selfish and self- centered as to REFUSE to care for themselves. Christians in the U.S., since the inception of the nation, have spent more time and their OWN money caring for others than Government programs ever could or would. Governments WASTE resources; they seldom ever use them judiciously. So, take off your rose tinted glasses and your blinders, and take a look at the world as it really is. Get off your butt and work for what you need, as Christianity teaches, instead of expecting handouts for indolence and laziness, as socialism advocates. There are, unfortunately too many lazy sheeple in the U.S. today who would rather become slaves to a socialist government than to live in freedom. They don't have the sense to realize that slavery was outlawed a long time ago.

Morell
  1/1/2016 11:13 EST

And yet in almost any index of "best countries" Sweden is in the top 10.

I don't think the fact that one Swede moved to the US is a big deal.

"A nation's greatness is measured by how it treats its weakest members." ~ Mahatma Ghandi

I am afraid that the US does not do well by this standard.

dbuddmd
  1/1/2016 12:00 EST

lovethebeach,
since the USA is All That and loaded with your type of "Christian" you are staying there, right? You'd hate Uruguay - it is, since Batlle y Ordenez, long ago, a Not Religious country by law, legal abortion, legal marijuana and the Frente Amplio has been quite socialist. Its programs have redistributed from the rich to the poor. You'd hate it here.
Please stay in the EEUU.

dbuddmd
  1/1/2016 12:41 EST

and it seems several combatants are sure (in opposition to mainstream medical evidence, yes i am a physician) that being gay is a choice....a choice to be oppressed, to be beaten up / gay bashed, a choice to be denied employment and possibly estranged from loved ones...sounds awesome! As one friend has said, if being gay was a choice, then clearly being straight is one as well.
crazyfarmer - do you recall when you chose to be straight? if you DO, there's a problem.
Every time a gay friend tells me how terrifying it was to realize (not choose) they were gay, i feel incredibly lucky to have been born straight.
and please, before you tell me what a Christian hater i am - i have been providing free room & board to an ordained & practicing Baptist minister (who was gentrified out of his apartment in the States) for almost a year now. so i can saySome of my best friends are real live Christians!
i personally go with the Dalai Lama:
"my religion is simple, my religion is kindness."

kimbo47
  1/1/2016 16:49 EST

LovetheBeach,
excellent!!! No one could have said it better.

kimbo47
  1/1/2016 17:00 EST

Morell's
can you define "its weakest members" Is it health, education, sex, age etc????

kimbo47
  1/1/2016 17:07 EST

dbuddmd,
why are you telling people what to do just because you don't agree with their opinions? I'm sure there are all different expats in UY that also don't agree with your opinion or dbuddmd's but they are there. Its a free exchange of opinions, suggestions and facts and it would be nice to keep it that way.

You can always answer by stating your position or disagreeing but not getting personal or conflictful.

Morell
  1/1/2016 18:43 EST

You would have to ask Ghandi.

To me it is anyone who requires some kind of support because of disability, advanced age, poverty, lack of education, abuse, or discrimination.

I have no problem with high taxes if they are used to provide healthcare, education and social supports for those in need.

dbuddmd
  1/1/2016 20:38 EST

yo kimbo47-ain't never-been-there-but-Trust-Me,
i do have a life, or i would dredge back and find the zillion times you have suggested otra pais options to folks on line here -as i recall you have brought up Ecuador, Belize, perhaps Chile and Colombia as places peeps might prefer to the land you've never been to. i was only suggesting, based on the material provided, that empirically, they'd be more content staying in the EEUU. i only provided historical and sociological facts for their edification. So mea cullpa.

dbuddmd
  1/1/2016 20:41 EST

oops. culpa, of course.
lo siento.

dbuddmd
  1/1/2016 20:41 EST

oops. culpa, of course.
lo siento.

kimbo47
  1/1/2016 20:57 EST

Yo Dbuddmd.
You are right I have SUGGESTED, to answer peoples questions, other countries which have a lower cost of living. But one thing is sharing information or SUGGESTING and another is giving a direct order in a satirical manner like > Please stay in the EEUU.<
Controlate!

kimbo47
  1/1/2016 21:20 EST

Morell's
I agree with you although I believe people should be held accountable for their choices in life.

If you live a life of song and dance not thinking of your old age I don't believe others should come to support you as you retire penniless. If you choose not to educate yourself why should others be responsible for your lack of education. Most countries provide free primary education and inexpensive state colleges with support for the really serious students. Also discrimination is taken care by existing laws in most civilized countries.

Bottom line I do believe in giving a hand to your fellow citizen in need but not in having your hard earned money distributed to others that chose to take it easy and not work or work the minimum and play the rest of the time.

I do believe some things can be socialized but with freedom like medicine.

kimbo47
  1/1/2016 21:34 EST

dbuddmd,
how did this important topic turn into a discussion of gays and religion?
I can see your kindness when you turn the other cheek and tell someone stay the heck out of UY!

>(who was gentrified out of his apartment in the States) <
Give me a break. I'm tired of seeing country bashing. Every country has examples of good and bad. I come here to learn facts about UY not to read about gays, religion or complaints about other countries.

The good folks on this forum do an excellent job of providing honest factual information about UY (w/o getting into all these foreign subjects) to help others make an educated decision of their place of choice to relocate.

Hopefully it will stay that way.

letsmove
  1/2/2016 04:42 EST

"The good folks on this forum do an excellent job of providing honest factual information about UY (w/o getting into all these foreign subjects)"

What is the name of this thread? Other good folks have their say about the situation in the states and these issues are an important part of why people consider moving. If fundamentalism is a concern for some, they may state so (you know, freedom of speech) and see if the same is happening in the country they are considering. So please try not to control the forum. We'd all appreciate it.

plantsandplaster
  1/2/2016 11:59 EST

LovetheBeach do you not see the irony in someone that chooses a pen name “LovetheBeach” telling someone that chooses the pen name “PlantsandPlaster” that they should “get off their butt and work”? You like relaxing at the beach obviously as much as I like working with plants and plaster. Yes I am a humble tradesman yet uneducated I am not. You also write that I “obviously have absolutely no understanding of either Christianity or of socialism”; that is incorrect, I am well versed in Christianity and many other cults and I am knowledgeable in politics, and for that matter science, history and philosophy.
I have studied the behaviour and utterances of some of the USA’s most notorious Christians namely; Cyrus Ingerson Scofield, Jack Van Impe, Hal Lindsey, Jimmy Lee Swaggart, James Orsen "Jim" Bakker, Billy Graham, and Charles Frazier Stanley.
I am also aware that the Christian Bible is based on the scribblings of a Semitic people sitting out in a desert some 2400, or so, years ago. (It may shock some xenophobic Christians when I point out that both Hebrew and Arab peoples are Semites). This leads me to my next point; the Christian Bible as the supposed word of a God, sets the precedent that it is OK to;
Kill people who don't listen to priests (Deuteronomy 17:12)
Kill witches (Exodus 22:17)
Kill homosexuals (Leviticus 20:13)
Kill fortune tellers (Leviticus 20:27)
Kill followers of other religions (Deuteronomy 13:7-12
Kill people for working on the Sabbath (Exodus 31:12-15)



Be put to death for hitting your parents (Exodus 21:15)
Be put to death for cursing your parents. (Proverbs 20:20) & (Leviticus 20:9)
Be put to death for adultery (Leviticus 20:10)
Be put to death for having sex out of wedlock (Leviticus 21:9) & (Deuteronomy 22:20-21)
Be put to death for being a nonbeliever (Exodus 22:19) & (2 Chronicles 15:12-13)
Be put to death for blasphemy (Leviticus 24:10-16)
Your God is also into genocide in a big way (Exodus 23:23), (Ezekiel 9:5-7), (1 Samuel 15:2-3), (Jeremiah 51:20-26), (Joshua 6:20-21), (Judges 20:48), (2 Kings 19:35), & (Jeremiah 50:21-22), and especially encouraged the slaughtering of children (Isaiah 14:21), (2 Kings 2:23-24), (Hosea 9:11-16), (Exodus 12:29-30), (Leviticus 26:21-22), & (Isaiah 13:15-18), in this last reference you will also see that your God also condones the rape of women as also seen in (Judges 21:10-24), (Judges 5:30), (Numbers 31:7-18), (Deuteronomy 22:28-29), (Deuteronomy 20:10-14), & (Zechariah 14:1-2), yet in his own merciful way your God prevents the anguish of this savagery haunting a woman’s thoughts as he also says that the rape victim should be killed (Deuteronomy 22:23-24).
As a student of your holy book you will be also aware that your God appreciated a bit of human sacrifice (Genesis 22:1-18), (Judges 11:29-40), (1 Kings 13:1-2), (2 Kings 23:20-25), and since you mentioned slavery; you would know that your God was not adverse to that either (Leviticus 25:44-46), (Exodus 21:2-6), (Exodus 21:7-11), (Ephesians 6:5), (Exodus 21:20-21), & (1 Timothy 6:1-2). So to summarize; yes I do know something about the religion you are a follower of.
I am well aware of the problems that the Swedes are having since they offered sanctuary to a large number of mid-East Asian refugees and the back lash now evidenced with some Swedes setting fire to refugee centres, yet please do not be too over reactive about the problems faced when a country offers succour to people from a different cultural background, remember many people in the USA are descendants of refugees e.g. the million Irish that left their homeland to escape the potato famine between the years 1845 and 1852.
Please do not insult me by saying I know nothing about socialism, as I have already stated; I have the impression that many people in the USA, including yourself obviously, have no idea at all about what socialism actually means. I have listened to one of your countries greatest stand up comediennes; Sarah “I can see Russia from my house” Palin spit the word out like it is something very nasty, when in fact it is just a belief that people should have an equal opportunity to achieve their full potential within a society and thus the capacity for that society to benefit from the contributions of all is maximized, it has nothing to do with giving people a free ride or being anti free enterprise.
You are not correct when you say I am blinkered, yet I think you are correct when you say I look at the world through rose tinted glasses, because I always look for the best in people and treat them with respect, irrespective of colour or creed, and that includes people like you.
Bruce

kimbo47
  1/2/2016 12:54 EST

Sorry letsmove ,
you have misinterpreted my post. I'm certainly not trying to control anything just learn from the good folks on this forum. I'm a firm believer in freedom of speech and freedom period.
I was just indicating in MHO that when the question is asked , for example what is the average salary in UY I'm looking for a number and maybe additional info on working there etc. not something else. As a newbie to UY I need concise answers. Sometimes the thread takes a different direction which is fine but in this case would best fit under a new thread titled for example "gays and religion" which will best lead you to know which post to read according to your needs. Just like an index in a book.
Again sorry if my post sounded as controlling it is just an opinion.

pasebien
  1/2/2016 16:08 EST

paintsandplaster -
spot on. thanks.

LtB may miss the irony as, to understand irony one needs to be able to hold two conflicting concepts simultaneously - a skill missing in, sadly, a majority of...types.

Last week (Harvard educated, tenured at Amherst - now at New School NYC - just so we know he's got the props) economist Richard Wolff did the second half of his weekly radio hour on socialism. Should anyone really want to know about the real thing:
http://www.rdwolff.com/content/economic-update-capitalism-andor-socialism
Again, it is the second half of this hour long piece.

cheers

crazyfarmer
  1/4/2016 00:08 EST

Sorry... couldn't let this one go unanswered. I don't have the time for a complete rebuttal of all of this. So I'll point out point out some of the ridiculous bits and share some truth. If anyone has more questions about any of this, feel free to send me a PM.

>I am also aware that the Christian
>Bible is based on the scribblings

... of scribes? These scribblings were very carefully written down and copied again and again with exacting precision. They clearly thought they were more important than you do.

>of a
>Semitic people sitting out in a desert
>some 2400, or so, years ago. (It may
>shock some xenophobic Christians

The vast majority of christians are not xenophobic.

>when I point out that both Hebrew
>and Arab peoples are Semites).

Most christians know this.

>Kill people who don't listen to priests
>(Deuteronomy 17:12)
>Kill witches (Exodus 22:17)
>Kill homosexuals (Leviticus 20:13)
>Kill fortune tellers (Leviticus 20:27)
>Kill followers of other religions
>(Deuteronomy 13:7-12
>Kill people for working on the
>Sabbath (Exodus 31:12-15)

>Be put to death for hitting your
>parents (Exodus 21:15)
>Be put to death for cursing your
>parents. (Proverbs 20:20) & (Leviticus
>20:9)
>Be put to death for adultery
>(Leviticus 20:10)
>Be put to death for having sex out of
>wedlock (Leviticus 21:9) &
>(Deuteronomy 22:20-21)
>Be put to death for being a
>nonbeliever (Exodus 22:19) & (2
>Chronicles 15:12-13)
>Be put to death for blasphemy
>(Leviticus 24:10-16)

You're ripping on christians, but these are all from the old testament. Are you going to rip on the Jews also? Because they follow these rules. We don't. This law was provided as a set of rules for a lawless people in a lawless time. Christians are no longer under the law.

>Your God is also into genocide in a
>big way

Again, only old testament. But it's true that the Israelites were sometimes used by God to bring judgement on other cultures. Similar judgements were also brought on the Israelites by neighboring cultures when they sinned as well.

>and especially encouraged the
>slaughtering of children

If a parent does something stupid, and it causes the death of their children, this is hardly God's fault. Wars lead to the death of children. The Israelites were on the giving and receiving end of this all the time. It's the real world. Pointing out this fact isn't encouraging anything. God never pours out wrath on a civilization without first giving them countless warnings and years, sometimes centuries to stop it.

>in this last reference you will also
>see that your God also condones
>the rape of women as also seen in

Again, warning of the consequences of your actions, not condoning or encouraging that behavior.

>yet in his own merciful way your
>God prevents the anguish of this
>savagery haunting a woman’s
>thoughts as he also says that the
>rape victim should be killed
>(Deuteronomy 22:23-24).

This isn't a case of rape. But whatever. God never condones or encourages rape.

>As a student of your holy book you
>will be also aware that your God
>appreciated a bit of human sacrifice

God never asks for human sacrifice. This is why Isaac was spared. The references you include here aren't human sacrifices. The priests were killed on the alters they used to do human sacrifices themselves.

>and since you mentioned slavery;
>you would know that your God was
>not adverse to that either

Again, acknowledging that slavery exists or using it as a judgement for sin isn't the same as telling people how wonderful it is. Jesus was all about freeing people.

>So to summarize; yes I do know
>something about the religion you
>are a follower of.

Actually, I'd say that even though you may have read it (I doubt it), you haven't understood anything. You've read it with an eye to discrediting it any way you can rather than making an honest effort to understand it.


>I am well aware of the problems that
>the Swedes are having since they
>offered sanctuary to a large number
>of mid-East Asian refugees and the
>back lash now evidenced with some
>Swedes setting fire to refugee
>centres, yet please do not be too
>over reactive about the problems
>faced when a country offers
>succour to people from a different
>cultural background,

Muslims are being brought to europe specifically to destroy those countries. They are an invading army. And if you want to talk about a religion that promotes death, rape, pedophilia, and slavery, have a look at the koran.

Back to Christianity...

You seem very angry at God. Otherwise, as an atheist, shouldn't you just ignore it? Why post an anti-christian rant?

kimbo47
  1/4/2016 12:59 EST

Brian,
your last two paragraphs are the honest raw thruth!!!!

Wanderlustspirit
  1/5/2016 02:09 EST

Can we agree to express our opinions while doing it from a position of respect?

UY is incredibly small. So when you put out very negative remarks about a particular group, just realize that those remarks are out there for all to see - current residents & future residents. You may limit potential friendships that you might have made here because why would someone want to make a connection with someone that thinks so little of someone without even knowing them as an individual person? Additionally, why would anyone feel compelled to use their most valuable resource (time) to help someone that holds negative views against a group that that person identifies with?

augieman
  1/5/2016 09:30 EST

Please.

What is a "chemtrail"?

Wanderlustspirit
  1/5/2016 22:11 EST

This is the best website to learn about geoengineering, chemtrails, engineered droughts & more.

http://www.geoengineeringwatch.org/

Excellent analysis. You can find declassified documents from the U.S. government about geoengineering efforts done since the 1960's.

LovetheBeach
  1/6/2016 00:31 EST

dbuddmd,
I left the U.S. a long time ago, and have no intention of going to Uruguay as it is too much like the U.S. I have found a much more peaceful, safe, sane, clean and healthy place to live.

LovetheBeach
  1/6/2016 00:40 EST

P & P, aka Bruce,
There is no irony in anything I wrote, or my name, as you have completely misinterpreted and twisted what I said in order to obfuscate and deceive. Loving the beach says no more than that. You have no earthly idea what I do or do not do, so stop being such an idiot!. You are quite obviously full of incredible anger, distrust, hate, and venom. And that is very, very, very unattractive. From your performance on this forum, it is also obvious that you have some serious issues with discrimination and hate mongering. I have no time in my life for people like you who have nothing better to do than tear down instead of build up, in spite of all your plaster!

letsmove
  1/6/2016 06:06 EST

Please, please, give it rest, will ya?

Wanderlustspirit
  1/6/2016 19:16 EST

Lovethebeach - Uruguay is not like the U.S. in many ways as I lived in the U.S. my whole life & it is different here in many ways. If you'd like to talk about the differences sometime, I'd be happy to have a conversation with you. The intolerance & judgments made towards you for identifying yourself as a Christian & shown on this thread by dmbudd, plantsandplaster & pasebien is not the norm here. The majority of expats I have interacted with, Christian & non-Christian, do not use harsh words & judgments without getting to know you as a person first thankfully. As Christians, we also need to be aware that we can come off as harsh & judgmental as well because we feel constantly on the defensive which was by design by the current administration. Christians are not currently under attack here except on boards like this where people can remain nameless.

Please do not judge the entire country by these responses & do not engage in the personal attacks. People are obviously angry & looking for other people to lash out at. The Saul Alinsky "Divide & Conquer" strategy being employed in the U.S. has infilitrated many people's mindsets & unconsciously, there is a focus on the things that separate us - not on the things that UNITE us.

There are amazing Christians here that live without the persecution that is now permeating the U.S. That said, you know the "rest of the story" and know that Christians will be persecuted throughout the world eventually.

Sadly I have found that the more tolerant people claim to be, the less tolerant they are in actuality.

I am disappointed to see what is supposed to be a helpful community digress into a community that instead wants to launch personal attacks at others than are different from themselves. Even though UY is a small country geographically, there is plenty of opportunity & allowance here for differences of opinion. I have found the country inclusive not exclusive.

Regardless, glad to read LovetheBeach that you have found a good place for you. Best of luck & try "turning the other cheek".

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