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Moving to Argentina

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mariomesquita
5/2/2016 14:29 EST

So...after some debate and evaluation, me and my wife decided that Argentina would be the place to move...we are planning a trip late this summer...considering visiting Mendoza and Buenos Aires, just to get a bit more acquainted with the Argentinian reality...
Would love to be able to find a small beach town where safety wouldn't be a concern...will appreciate suggestions...I'm fluent in 4 languages, being Spanish one of them, but my wife is limited to English and a bit of French...so any area where an active expat community exist would be an asset...both of us are very easy going, both of us travelled and lived around the world, being South America our final destination, we would greatly appreciate any input/ advice...cheers!

Placestogo6
5/2/2016 15:02 EST

i know of an expensive expat community in salto , argentina : http://www.lec.com.ar/ Argentina now taxes worldwide and has introduced wealth tax... i do not know the details... may or not be relevant to you?

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mariomesquita
5/2/2016 15:37 EST

Well, first of all thank you for your prompt response, and "expensive" is not what we would be looking for, like I mentioned before, we are simple people, who love to interact with locals and willing to embrace culture and habits of the country we settle in...active expact community would be an asset in order to obtain information, guidance, and who knows friendships, for an easier integration...I'm 42 years old, my wife is 37, even though we have no children, Argentina might be our "final destination"...have done quite a bit of research, but as I mentioned before, we have lived in several places around the world, and we know that the most accurate info about places to settle, quality (reality)of life, is provided by someone in the "same shoes"...
What we are looking for:
- small/ mid size town with good infrastructure
- near the beach would be perfect
- safe environment
- low / medium cost of living
Thank you so much for all the input, all of it will be greatly appreciated...
Cheers,

todikaios
5/2/2016 16:10 EST

Why not North Carolina or Virginia near the coast. I doubt you will find Argentina to your liking...perhaps your grandchildren will be accepted but you will always be thought of as. Outsiders.

SaintJohn
5/2/2016 17:37 EST

mariomesquita, I think you'll get better answers, if you give us a brief overview of what your research has told you.

I assume that by "this summer" you mean "this winter" (eg. August), if not, you are almost a year early.

mariomesquita
5/2/2016 17:59 EST

Absolutely right SaintJohn...my apologies..
Yes when I say Summer I'm referring to mid/late September, so I guess your winter there...
About the research, my conclusions:
- possible to live with a budget of $ 2.000 us / month for 2 adults
- that would include rent, utilities, no car, some medical,
- unless you start your own business, or have a steady source of income abroad, jobs will be hard to find, and always dependant of work visas, that might be hard to get..
For the initial phase of our transition to Argentina, me and my wife were thinking of renting a place, get acquainted with the Argentinian reality, and then decide if a possible investment would've the right thing to do...
We are not planning on getting rich with whatever business we might start, (if start at all), just have the means to achieve the goals...
We are looking for ideas of places/ towns, with the criterias mentioned on my other posts, and we will go from there, and if possible a more updated cost of living in whatever regions that might be mentioned,( rent, food, infrastructure)...
Thank you all..

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worldofthecitizen
5/5/2016 16:53 EST

As far as beach towns, there aren't any really in the immediate vicinity of Buenos Aires, notwithstanding that it is on the water. If beach town is a priority, you could go to Mar del Plata or Pinamar, though these will not have the same cultural opportunities. Personally I would live in Buenos Aires and drive to Pinamar when I wanted the beach experience. There are also beaches in Uruguay. Punta del Este would likely be too expensive but there are others. Mendoza is a great town but I wonder if there would be a large enough expat community? I have only visited Mendoza as a tourist, so I'm not sure. If you do move to Buenos Aires, you can connect with expats through BAIN (Buenos Aires International Newcomers).

mariomesquita
5/5/2016 21:18 EST

Thank you very much for all the input worldofthecitizen, greatly appreciated..????

maxpgotz
8/9/2016 13:35 EST

I myself am partial to Miramar, some 40 minutes south of Mar del Plata... but I have to agree with what was said about living in Buenos Aires and going every so often to the beach... most of our seaside towns are sleepy, smaller towns which come alive during the summer (save Mar del Plata)... if I can be of any help, our firm does full-service real estate specializing in expatriates. Regards and good luck! Max Götz, My Argentina home

TomP
8/10/2016 07:50 EST

Argentina has an "Asset Tax" of 1% thus if you purchased a home for US$100,000 you owe US$ 1,000. If you buy a car for US$10,000 in theory you'll owe another US$100 each year. And you don't want to skip paying the tax because you will soon be introduced to the long arm of AFIP (Argentina's IRS).

expat0tree
8/10/2016 12:25 EST

Tom,

Finally someone brought AFIP into the picture, it's important to mention that Macri's government is cracking down on undeclared properties, anything above AR $800,000 has 10% tax and if not declared and paid by the end of 2016 it goes up to 15%, this is a recent thing by the wat, it's called Tax Amnesty Law, released this month, although slight adjustments to law are still worked on.

to avoid paying this much one would have to declare their assets, be it in form of cash or real estate, as a donation but then you'd have to show a transaction and prove it's donation. therwise i'd go for a house or apartment that is assessed much below it's purchase price and then one could pay as little as 5% or nothing at all if 2 people are on the title of house worth AR$600,000 or less, which in real life is non existent.

Mind you tons of people in Argentina have undeclared assets in one form or another so it's going to be a long mouse and cat game, but they WILL come after you eventually, Macri received briefings from Obama's accounting team when they met and is prepared to enforce laws, something that previous government failed to do, thus the reasons why most people avoided paying taxes, etc. Things are changing, especially now that the government is under pressure to raise money fast.

having said that, homes in neglected neighborhoods with poor infrustructure and below average value won't be touched by AFIP anytime in the next 10 years simply because they do not have the needed army of tax accountant to go after disadvantaged majority.

As for a beach front house with good infrustructure, i'm not sure if that's even an option for somone who does not have a job waiting for them here.

I would compromise and let go of the beach idea altogether and settle someone in the outskirts of BA, yes with negros if need be, because for US$100,000 you can buy a fantastic house on big beautiful lot, and have enough money left to eat well for at least 6 months without income.

hope this helps

TomP
8/10/2016 13:42 EST

I have retained an Argentine CPA for seven years now who handles all of my books for my vineyards. I pay all Government mandated wages and 23% additional benefits plus any IVA due for materials like vineyard infrastructure, a Worker's house I built and a water well I had drilled. I've never had one single problem with AFIP.

By the way I didn't know there existed all Black" or "Negro" areas outside of BA. Interesting.

expat0tree
8/11/2016 07:26 EST

Tom,

So called 'negro' - neighborhood is not a segrated area just for negros, you right, but people from better areas called them this way because of all the garbage there, lack of infrastructure and bad construction, and that's aparently what makes them negros, plus the high uneployment makes them scout for money desperately, so they end up going to cleaner streets to steal, thus further angering the so called 'non-negro' working class, but in reality they all look the same.

TomP
8/11/2016 07:34 EST

expat0tree,

Thanks for the information.

If one looks at Argentina's history he will find that at one time Argentina, especially BA, tried to isolate and purge all blacks and unlike Brasil many Argentines I have met want to be considered pure "European" and do not emphasize their multi-cultural ethnic background..

DonaldGraham
8/12/2016 02:32 EST

I would love to live in Argentina

TomP
8/12/2016 08:03 EST

Why? This is a sincere question?

pampas
8/12/2016 17:06 EST

You could Try San Rafael in Mendoza province. It tics the boxes for you. Not on the coast though.

TomP
8/12/2016 18:53 EST

Naturally I am bias for San Rafael because I have vineyards there.

You could live on US$2,000 monthly without a car unless you have the capital to buy one. Even junkers fetch good money.

True, there is no coast but about 30 minutes form the city's center is valle Grande that has fishing, river rafting, swimming, kayaking, hiking, horse back riding, rock climbing and more.

todikaios
8/13/2016 02:28 EST

I am also biased but practical. Having traveled a fair amount, I have seen many places in the world where you can live on $2000/month more comfortably than San Rafael. Until the inflation ends and economic recovery is well underway I know of no sane reasons for moving to Argentina, save possible family/personal relationships.

TomP
8/13/2016 08:56 EST

todikaios,

Please, share with us, say just the top five other places in the world that you can comfortably live for US$2,000 a month. I am sure the readers will appreciate your input.

guestuser
8/14/2016 23:51 EST

Bumping in from the Colombia forum (I was asked if I was interested in a consulting role in BA for a few months so I wanted to check this forum) if anyone doubts that you can live pretty well on $2,000 a month there are several places in Colombia where retirees live pretty well on that sort of money.
$2,000 here equates to 10 times the prevailing minimum wage

arleankelley
8/23/2016 06:01 EST

I have lived in Buenos Aires for six years, full time. I love it here, I am not finding it difficult to find friends. However, if you don't find many in the locals, the expat population is huge. I invite you to come to Four Flags Journal on the Internet and read the entries about our view of Argentina.

arleankelley
8/23/2016 06:15 EST

I agree with living in Buenos Aires and either driving or taking a bus when you want to go to the beach. That's what the locals in Buenos Aires do. Buenos Aires is loaded with culture. But if you're the type that doesn't care bout that, just want a swimsuit or a fishing pole, there are other options that are not hick towns.

In that case the Mar del Plata area could be a good one. I will tell you some places I like. Viedma is on the Rio Negro and 15 minutes from the ocean with not only the water to swim but the best fishing I ever saw. Fishing there is almost like cheating. Sort of like the fish there never heard of bait on hooks.

But also there is Bariloche, a ski resort in Patagonia near the Andes. It isn't exactly on the beach but the most beautiful lake you can imagine, Nahuel Huapi, which does have sand beaches--and no sharks. (Hehe just kidding) The lake is backdropped with mountains. It is an amazing tourist destination, which some people don't like but we did. We lived there when we first arrived. Rent was reasonable then but I don't know about now. If you don't like tourists but lake swimming will do, ,there are lots of opportunities in that area. Incredible beauty with fresh water beaches. Villa la Angostura would be one where, unless it has changed, rents are low. It does snow there though. Good luck. If you think about it, let us know what you find when you get here.

jaym
9/23/2016 01:43 EST

This board has some really arrogant and rude people on it. Pity.

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