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Viktor orban

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Michael1967
  9/22/2016 03:35 EST

I was looking for peoples opinions on his policies.Do most Hungarians support his cause,on keeping the country free of refugees.

peddington
  9/22/2016 04:37 EST

I guess soon we will find out as the Hungarians are about to vote on this issue but turnout has to be at least 51% before the voting results are considered valid. From what I seen overwhelmingly people are against refugees. Something understandable for a country of less than 10 million.

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Angiegirl
  9/22/2016 13:28 EST

Mr. Orban is the best thing that ever happened to Hungary. He is not prejudiced; he just wants to keep the 'flavor' which is Hungary. And, that is, a mostly Christian nation which does not support the teachings of ISLAM!!! These people are not refugees/they not-so-silent invaders! NO way to let them in or stay...Minimum is not even good enough...Hungary doesn't want to be invaded by Muslims!!!

Michael1967
  9/22/2016 13:53 EST

I agree on him keeping out Arabs,they are too radical.Most will cause. Chaos and more welfare with there large families too follow.Keep on building those walls.

borschelrh
  9/23/2016 04:12 EST

You have to look at this issue carefully. If you mean Muslim refugees then the answer would be an overwhelming yes. This country still very vividly remembers that the real end of the Hungarian monarchy ended with the Turkish invasion which also ended up with about half a million dead and 160 years of horror. This ended with the "rescue" by the Habsburgs and Russian monarchies and effectively ended the Hungary as an independent nation except for a brief period. The resultant involvement in WWI ended up with Hungary losing more than 2/3 of their territory. So, one could blame the Turkish invasion (in a simplistic way) as the root cause of all of their modern troubles.

BUt, it goes further than that. Hungary is proud to be Hungarian and want Hungary to stay that way. They have a good immigration policy which requires proof of independent income or a necessary job skill. Economic refugees are not welcome from any group.Most of these immigrants are not who they say they are and the vast majority are not fleeing from a desperate situation. Most are coming from refugee camps in Turkey where they were already safe therefore do not qualify as refugees. Additionally, most came through Greece, a member of the EU, therefore are required to be processed there. The actual verification of identity and status can take years (as the DoS spokesman said 2 days ago regarding US immigrants). Hungary has a very small immigration workforce so processing 15 a day is about all the can handle. On top of that, last year's influx out of roughly 200,000 refugees only 20 qualified as actual refugees.

Additionally, unemployment here is sufficient to supply able bodied and trained workers for all expected needs so no new immigrants, especially untainable ones, are needed. Germany is a good example of this problem. Of all the immigrants accepted by Merkel there is a 99.7% unemployment rate because they are unemployable and untrainable. Hungary cannot nor should they be expected to support people like this. Life is tough enough here without the additional costs to support immigrants. Hungary is better served to support their own population rather than people coming from other nations who add nothing to the Hungarian economy.

Tomrock
  9/23/2016 08:18 EST

Merkel invited those arabs to Germany and now she realize the mistake she has made. Her solution is to distribute this problem to other EU countries who where against her actions from the start. I don't want to live in a multicultural society with all these 3rd country scum, this is one of the reasons I moved to Hungary.

On October 2 I'm voting against taking any sh@t from other countries.

Personally I feel like Orban wasn't tough enough last year when they were at the border throwing stones and attacking the border. If Hungary will take even one of these "refugees" then next election I will vote for Jobbik.

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borschelrh
  9/23/2016 08:54 EST

Yes, vote and exercise your responsibility as a citizen. Several other factors are also worth considering. The middle east was disrupted through actions by the US and its partners in the EU. Hungary was also involved as well. The best course would be to stop fighting in the Middle East and to begin rebuilding infrastructure. If you examine China who accepts zero refugees or immigrants at all, they are very actively building factories, railroads, and important infrastructure projects in Africa and South America. By building the economies of these regions to provide self sufficiency and bring them up to Western living standards is the best and most profitable solution. If you want to end the mass migration which is imminent this is the best way to do it. Bombing them results in the opposite. Bringing them in to ruin our regions is not the answer. Europe should be for Europeans and I believe strongly that peoples have developed over time to be regional both in values and behavior. Moving them into already established regions destroys that region's identity. Ultimately, this will end in failure. That is an easy prediction. Merkel and her ilk will cause the devlopment of new ultra-right nationalistic movements in all countries effected and if the killing/raping/robbing continues the results will be horrifying. Maybe this is what they actually want? The destruction of Europe?

EllaS
  3/9/2017 12:57 EST

I would like to tip my hat to you for so eloquently saying what you did. I get too emotional and it is best if I remain quiet. You are 100% correct - God bless and keep Orban!

peddington
  3/9/2017 13:12 EST

And thousands of Hungarian senior citizens will agree with you including my mother 83 years old and my aunt 82 years old. They lived under Communism and Mr Orban can do no wrong. The elderly is not open to broader definition of personal freedom and doesn't mind if the government tells them what to do! Surely they have a good reason for doing so! Like close stores on Sunday because people should go to church or spend time with family. Surely the people can't decide that for themselves the government need to legislate it - right? If you receive a automated speeding ticket there is no need to have your say in front of a traffic court judge because surely the police was correct, the equipment was calibrated and there couldn't possible been any extenuating circumstance etc, etc. I guess it ALL depend what one is used to - right!?

Angiegirl
  3/9/2017 14:33 EST

I understand your point of view, but considering what life was like when my dear, late father escaped with us during 56; it is a lot better! And, having stores closed on Sunday is not a bad thing...people need to rest also who work in those stores! I am sure they are not against spending more time with their kids and loved ones! There will always be a store somewhere that is open...who cares? I remember growing up in NYC and stores used to ALL be closed on Sundays..Nobody died because of it!

peddington
  3/9/2017 15:46 EST

Well if I may say so you missing some of the points Tom was trying to make. (and here I will chime in if I may). First when the "Sunday Law" was passed I saw a discussion on TV where a government representative stated that some 80% of supermarket workers agreed with the Sunday closure. What wasn't obvious to most of you is that the survey was done ONLY with CBA employees. (Tom eluded to that in a way). Second the Sunday Law EXEMPTED small stores (maybe under 200 sq meters or something like that) but ONLY if the owner's family members worked in the store. On another TV show the issue was raised that many people normally wouldn't mind working Saturday and Sunday because there is additional pay involved. The problem was (and I know this from people working for these stores) that they WON'T pay the differential. In this TV show this was raised as an excuse to do away with Sunday shopping. The host of the show however asked: Why don't you send in state inspectors to check these stores books and if they violated the law fined them. The government representative couldn't give an answer. So I guess my thing is that the system is "rigged"...maybe a different way than back home never the less "rigged"!

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Angiegirl
  3/9/2017 18:51 EST

Interesting with all the add'l info you provide...thank you.

borschelrh
  3/10/2017 00:32 EST

I know this is going to raise some hackles so bear with me on this. Personally, from the perspective of the Russians, I consider the revolutionaries of 1956 to have gotten what they deserve. Look at it a bit differently and you might understand what I mean. You also have to keep it separate the government and the people (like in the US) so it gets a bit complicated. It all boils down to the Trianon treaty and the loss of roughly 66% of Hungarian land. That seems unfair and perhaps it was but the winners always get to decide the fate of the losers. However, many Hungarians believed that was unjust and wanted to recover the lost territories. Hitler made them that promise if they willingly joined the German Army which is what happened and Hungary was a willing vassal state to the German Empire under Hitler. Never forget that because it is extremely important. Hungary invaded the Soviet Union and committed atrocities there. A large part of the German Army besieging Stalingrad was made up of Hungarians who lost a terrible amount of people in that battle. After Stalingrad it was pretty clear how the war was going to end up and Hungary then switched sides (more or less) at the end of the war and it was then that the Germans in Hungary repressed Hungarians and began the murdering of Jews (with a large force of willing Hungarians). I am oversimplifying a complex history but basically this is how it went. Toward sthe end of the war the Soviet Army fought in Hungary to free the Hungarians from the German oppression and continued their push of the Germans in Europe back into Germany. After freeing Hungary from the Germans and as part of the agreement between Roosevelt, Churchill and Stalin Hungary became the responsibility (like all of Eastern Europe) of the Soviet Union. Hungary had been treated somewhat well up until 1956 and enjoyed a lot of things most people in the Soviet sphere didn't Compare life in East Germany to Hungary and you might appreciate that. The 1956 revolution was brought about by none other than our famous CIA and Hungary was abandoned by Eisenhower and left to their plight. The plotters escaped to other countries and yet now are coming back home. The Soviets were less than pleased at the uprising and clamped down hard after that. Remember this was only 11 years after the war ended. We were still occupying Germany (up until 1972 and some might argue we are still there) and imagine what we would have done if the Germans had revolted against the US like the Hungarians did against the Soviets? If you talk to the working class here most might agree that life under communism was a lot better than it is now. So, it all depends on your perspective.

It was this same bizarre attitude which has caused the financial problems in Hungary following the breakup of the Soviet Union. Hungary's trading partners were mostly Russia and the former Soviet Republics and allied states. Hungary had a great deal of the Soviet manufacturing and agricultural industries. They made all the televisions and computers (Videoton) for the entire Soviet Union, all the buses (Icarus), had the best produce, meat etc. (includes Globus), and a lot of other things. Hungarians, unlike anywhere else were permitted to run private small businesses and farmers could have plots for truck gardens even though collectivization of agriculture confiscated all farmland to the state. Hungary enjoyed 100's of mines and had an enormous industry. But, the party (I forget which one) that took power after the fall of the Soviets cut off all trade with Russia, their only trading partner. They haven't recovered since. When Hungary joined the EU (IMHO a stupid move) they had to adopt ISO9000 safety requirements within 90 days. An impossible and horribly expensive task which resulted in the closure of the majority of industries and mining. Basically, the ruling party sold the country out and Hungary (along with other Eastern European countries who joined the EU) is not an equal partner. Shop here and you will see the favored pricing of German French, or Dutch goods. Go to any other country in Europe and you won't find Hungarian goods for sale so it is completely one direction. So, there are a lot of problems and only Orban has made any effort to renew trade with Russia. My guess is Hungary will leave the EU eventually as I just don't see things changing from the EU side as they simply don't consider Hungary as an equal partner. Things are in flux.

borschelrh
  3/10/2017 05:07 EST

We have a woman who cleans our house on Sundays who works full time at a CBA. She told me that they cut hours during the day so the workers have to work 6 days a week now with the same staffing levels but less hours per day. All that hassle and she gets 400 HUF an hour and has worked there over 10 years. She makes almost as much in 5 hours at our house as she makes the rest of the week at CBA.

Grazka
  3/10/2017 07:23 EST

Very well said borschelrh! Agree 100%.!'
I was living myself in communistic country.
So I knew exactly what are u talking about.
Joining the EU was the biggest mistake ( read stupidity) of all eastern block countries.
And was only one reason for it... make Germany ( manly) richer,stronger and more powerful....What they didn't achieve in WWI and WWII they achieve peacefully making EU with fake promises. And don't forget that Germany is a puppet....Doing dirty jobs for those who running whole world....
EU will die ...mater of time....so Hungary don't even need to leave it....
Still the future is very unknown......can't see even communistic time ever come back......and looking from the perspective this was a good time. Lots of people listening BS propaganda......
I'll happy to swap for those time.

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