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Cost of living Colombia vs Argentina

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morganstern
  2/11/2020 06:16 EST

When I mentioned that I was moving to Buenos Aires a couple of people were curious about cost of living there. So I will post differences in costs from time to time...differences up or down.

SkyMan
  2/11/2020 09:30 EST

Morganstern...have you moved already ? If so...how do you like it there ? Buena Suerte !

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PFleetwood
  2/11/2020 13:26 EST

Yes! I love BA and Argentina. If as affordable as Colombia these days I'm there!

morganstern
  2/11/2020 15:04 EST

I am on the way.....stopping in Santiago...12 days more! I did see my sunblock on the net in BA for $14. US......$34 US in Bogota. Just one thing to start it off!

guestuser
  2/11/2020 16:57 EST

Thanks i am interested

guestuser
  2/11/2020 17:01 EST

based on this, looks close
you would also have to factor in taxes and airfare


https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?country1=Argentina&city1=Buenos+Aires&country2=Colombia&city2=Medellin

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guestuser
  2/11/2020 17:05 EST

Anyone know how the single life is? Medellin is fantastic and i am not referencing the hourly girls.
Women between 35 and 45 fall out of trees in Medellin

older but still relevant

https://medellinguru.com/medellin-vs-buenos-aires/

says Argentina less expensive

https://www.expatistan.com/cost-of-living/comparison/medellin/buenos-aires


https://www.expatistan.com/cost-of-living/comparison/buenos-aires/medellin

mattinnorfolk
  2/11/2020 17:10 EST

I would love to know the answer to this Burns, as I have only read they are not as interested in gringos. I would like to here it from someone who knows. Thanks!

guestuser
  2/11/2020 18:24 EST

I have read "Unlike Colombia, where the women specifically look to meet men from abroad, Argentinian women do not have the goal of meeting foreigners. They are open to it if the opportunity arises. However, most Argentinian girls are not dreaming of Gringo to have a love affair with."

not sure but sounds good, I am a very good Spanish speaker so i would definitely be up for the challenge

guestuser
  2/11/2020 18:26 EST

Are the women of Argentina worth it?

It really boils down to how time and energy are you willing to invest. Premium talent like the women of Argentina comes with a cost. Men who are who are just embarking on their Latin American travel experience should consider Peru and the Dominican Republic where their exotic factor will be in their favor. Many men have traveled to Argentina and felt disappointed in their results. However, players who speak Spanish and who are experienced with seducing Latinas can find of a paradise of beautiful Latinas in Argentina.

Remember, time is a critical factor in dating in Argentina. It takes time to crack into tight social circles. If you are short on time (less than 2 weeks), you are better off traveling to Peru, the Dominican Republic or Brazil. However, If you have a few months and possess the right traits, then Argentinian women are worth it


https://www.themasculinetraveler.com/argentinian-women-are-they-worth-it/

PFleetwood
  2/11/2020 19:10 EST

I don't know about the rest of the country but the women in Buenos Aires are hot and flirtatious. From my experience at least. Uruguayans disapprove and think BAers are too passionate. But if you are not desirable on your own merits the income discrepancy is not as large as the Philippines or Colombia and not nearly as big an aphrodisiac to attractive woman, who is more independent thete. IMO.

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novato1953
  2/11/2020 19:46 EST

Last time I was in Argentina the one and pretty much only cheap thing was beef -- the exchange rate was ~15ARS per USD (2017). Buenos Aires prices were not for the faint of heart. I learned to expect a cup of coffee to run ~$5US. Now the exchange is ~60ARS per $, but inflation? Officially, 52% in December, 2019. I expect it's a coin toss, pricewise -- but I bet beef will still be cheap. Counterfeit currency was alive and well, too, which is a pain the ass. But Argentines are an entertaining bunch -- Buenos Aires has more psychologists per capita than any other world capital.

Elexpatriado
  2/11/2020 22:33 EST

Not as many desperate single mothers willing to degrade themselves with decrepit old gringos in Argentina like in Colombia

morganstern
  2/12/2020 07:07 EST

Argentina vs Colombia.....well Burns has pissed all over my idea...I am out of here.

SkyMan
  2/12/2020 10:45 EST

Please look at these "statistics" with a questionable eye, as they are all skewed in one direction or another. I still believe that what part of any city in which you choose to live & the lifestyle you choose to live are the two(2) items that will determine your monthly expenses in any country. for eexample: Quito Ecuador is much more expensive than Cuenca, Ecador & Loja, Ecuador & yes, I have spent time in all three(3) of these cities. Buena Suerte !

SkyMan
  2/12/2020 10:47 EST

Elex...How True...True ! Buena Suerte !

SkyMan
  2/12/2020 10:49 EST

morganstern....please keep us in the loop as to your feelings about BA...there's always an interest in trying a new locale...it it's worth it. Boots-on-the-ground=best way to know about a new country. Buena Suerte !

Explorer88
  2/12/2020 15:46 EST

How repulsive to read comments treating women as some kind of purchasable objects on here. This is just one of the reasons to stay far away from most expats!

JustSomeGuy
  2/12/2020 16:53 EST

And yet you are not only not repulsed but you interact. People are strange aren’t they?

WhoaNellie
  2/12/2020 17:03 EST

Someone should tell that to all these women in/around Medellín advertising themselves as "purchasable objects" under Servicios personales:

https://medellin.locanto.com.co/Servicios-personales/209/

I don't think any of them are expats...

ponymalta2
  2/13/2020 05:21 EST

Explorer88

I am not defending that attitude but 97% of the business for prepagadas in Colombian is probably from Colombian men, and loose on going financial arrangements are also entirely common. So it isn't just Expats, but maybe some are more open about it on this forum than locals might be.

spikerivet
  2/13/2020 08:00 EST

Burns, I have several of those cost of living surveys. And one of the ones you cite, Expatistan, has a lot of similar findings, to the other surveys, except for Argentina where the findings seem skewed to show that Argentina has a very cheap cost of living.

However, they are very big on Mendoza as a city and in that case I could see where being in a sort of isolated, agricultural region, it could be pretty cheap.

morganstern
  2/13/2020 09:26 EST

Especially for Skyman......I think Skyman gets it! Let's face it...to most Colombia is about the cost of living. Well, now get this....the official conversion of the Arg peso is about 63. The Blue peso is about 75-76. Problem is two things.....Numbero was using 60....sixty....the other day. And....using Western Union....THE REAL CONVERSION IS ABOUT 83 TO THE DOLLAR. Meaning go to a restaurant and your discount is 25% to 33% depending on which way you calculate it. This is big time to me!!!!! (and.....Numbero is questionable on all accounts)

Electricista
  2/13/2020 11:28 EST

I see the official rate today is 61.4014 ARS. The rate offered by World Remit is just a hair lower.
However Western Union is offering 86.41 this morning. I assume the blue rate is that which can be obtained on the streets of BA. How can western union offer a better rate than the street rate? I don't doubt the data. I am just puzzled how it is possible.

morganstern
  2/13/2020 16:54 EST

Electricista....why...because sometimes there IS a god.

Elexpatriado
  2/14/2020 10:36 EST

Funny how it is ..I always ask.Taxistas ( in Colombia and now Ecuador) do you hsve a family?

I get 2vtypes of answers..

First answer..si tengo 4 hijos ..pero de 4 mujeres..

They are dead serious..but then laugh and smile..they are very proud of themselves..

The second type of answer I get is

" si estoy casado.por 8 ( or 10 or 2o) años.

I then ask them if they have any " mosas" ( girlfriends)

They say " no..no tengo plata" or "antes si, ahora no..no tengo.plata"

I then ask them "If you had money would you have a mosa?"

The answer is always " claro que si" or " por supuesto..varios"

Yep ..North American, Australian or European men are misoginistic pigs..

But compared to Latinos thry are naive white knight Capn save a hoe beta manginas..

Thats why Gringas and Euro Trash women love " Latin Lovers"

And with Russian, Afro and Muslim men the treatment of women only gets worse

8

Electricista
  2/14/2020 11:36 EST

I did some more research and it appears that Argentina has , within the last six months, become a viable contender for a place to hang-out during retirement. The retirement visa income requirements are now very similar to that of Colombia. The income requirement would have originally been higher than Colombia but inflation has now brought it down to a level that even a poor Canadian can retire there. From an internet perspective, and using the Western Union exchange rate, it appears that many small towns in Argentina are cheaper than Pereira. I am now considering a visit to check it all out.

PFleetwood
  2/14/2020 12:56 EST

Me too. But I wonder about the exchange rate fluctuation. I think it is more likely to go back up in Argentina. But just guessing.

Blenheim
  2/14/2020 14:44 EST

Have yet to meet poor Canadian--

See then around south Texas in the fall --- "Eh?"

morganstern
  2/14/2020 16:45 EST

Electricista.....and now you know why I started this thread. Few know that Buenos Aires is now statistically cheaper than Bogota! And since I have always wanted to get to BA...now is the perfect time. Another heads up....starting last month a new Airline route from Bogota to BA, through Santiago. I took it...and saved money. Jestsmart. Very cool airline. (with 4 bags)

morganstern
  2/15/2020 06:57 EST

Prices....

Silk Soy milk $2.35 AR / $3.99 Bogota
Clight $..19 AR /.$42 Bogota
Kellogs Musli $2.15 AR/$4.05 Bogota
Bottled orange juice...same price

ISDIN...the number one recommended sun block by Bogota dermatologists....

$32.00 Bogota $14 AR (I am going to confirm this at the drug store in BA)

egg....about the same price

I am very curious about every day taxi costs

SkyMan
  2/15/2020 10:28 EST

morganstern...thanks for the price-updates. Quite interesting....it's always good to have another country to consider, if things change appreciably here in Colombia. Buena Suerte !

Elexpatriado
  2/15/2020 16:35 EST

I could live in Mendoza or Neuquen

Bariloche..but only in summer

SkyMan
  2/17/2020 11:52 EST

Elex...I spent four(4) days in Bariloche...reminded me of an Austrian town...architecture. Gets really cold in the winter there I hear. It also has an interesting history. Buena Suerte !

morganstern
  2/20/2020 07:03 EST

Cost of steak....

The highest price I could find in Carrulla was about $10 per pound

In Buenos Aires Jumbo $3.66 per pound

JustSomeGuy
  2/21/2020 12:35 EST

In Bogotá you are a few degrees away from the Equator and at 8000 feet, serious sun burn potential. BA is sea level and out of the tropics. You will probably use a lot less sunscreen.

FrozenPonds
  2/27/2020 15:30 EST

Buenos Aires...no thanks! Was there in August with my gf to visit her brother, sister in law and niece. Will never go back...HATED it!

Ordered Tuna sushi at a "sushi" restaurant and.....wait for it...wait for it...it was CANNED tuna !! BLAHHHHHH

Perhaps it is my love of Bogota, Cartagena and the rest of this country that makes me biased towards anywhere else...including the home to the Groper, blockades and UN Security Council seekers..aka Canada!

Elexpatriado
  2/28/2020 10:02 EST

There area lot of cool places in Argentina. Cant judge a place by a single visit and a single incident.

Bogota is not on the top f my list anywhere. As far as big cities, I like Quito a lot better.

FrozenPonds
  2/28/2020 15:56 EST

Never been to Ecuador...but will definitely go at some point!

SkyMan
  3/1/2020 10:10 EST

Quito Ecuador is a pretty nice city, big but spread-out. That Parque Carolina(I believe that's the name) is huge. Some really good restaurants there also. Of course it's the Capital of Ecuador & there's so much government money flowing there...like most capital cites. Decent climate and a good entertainment district too. I spent some time there...it's too cool for me ...but a nice city. Buena Suerte !

Electricista
  3/1/2020 13:38 EST

I can handle the coolness. I just can't handle the lack of oxygen. It would not be so bad if the old city did not have as many hills.

SkyMan
  3/1/2020 15:27 EST

In Quito I was not really bothered at all by the altitude(did some serious walking there too !) It's about 8,500 ft. I think but I'm in pretty good shape(goin g to gym four(4) days/wk. lots of walking always.)...so I was fine, but no mtn.-climbing for me. Buena Suerte !

WhoaNellie
  3/1/2020 15:46 EST

I think much of Quito is above 9000 ft. Where I lived as a kid, it was over 9300 ft.

I liked the weather in Quito better than Bogotá, which is lower in altitude but seems colder and rainier to me. Both have too many people for me!

Elexpatriado
  3/1/2020 18:46 EST

I am not worried about lack of Oxygen in Quito-pretty low for me.

I climbed Cayambe 5700 m, Cotapaxi 5900 M and the lower peak of Chimbarazo 6230 m.

Couldnt get to the slightly higher (Whymper) summit 6270 M due to Hurricane force winds and white out conditions.

Elexpatriado
  3/1/2020 18:48 EST

For you Yanks 6230 M is a little over 20,000 feet

morganstern
  3/4/2020 10:02 EST

Price of chicken....

I bought a package of six frozen wings in the supermarket. The price was .70$ for the package. Crazy....70 cents for the six frozen wings.

Also, the drop price for taxis is 73 cents. The taxis are pretty much the same....big sedans and very nice condition.

mikedanbury
  3/4/2020 10:21 EST

other than prices how does BA compare to Medellin?

Electricista
  3/4/2020 11:28 EST

Are the people in BA as friendly as those in Bogota (or other Colombian cities)? When I was in Caracas I noticed that rudeness was very ingrained into their city's culture. The children of Caracas, in my opinion, appear to be taught by example to be rude. In Quito, less friendly than Bogota but not rude.

morganstern
  3/4/2020 19:15 EST

Buenos Aires does does not compare with Medellin...it compares with NY or maybe San Francisco. The people are noticeably less friendly than the people in Colombia...actually....not even close. On that level Colombia is a lot more fun.

morganstern
  3/4/2020 19:21 EST

Buenos Aires does does not compare with Medellin...it compares with NY or maybe San Francisco. And BA is HUGE. The people are noticeably less friendly than the people in Colombia...actually....not even close. On that level Colombia is a lot more fun.

morganstern
  3/4/2020 19:22 EST

Eggs..we all gotta' have eggs. 30 eggs cost $2.00 US

CAtoMDE
  3/4/2020 21:56 EST

@ Electricista - Interesting observation about the rudeness a taught behavior in the kids/people of Caracas.

I have had many discussions about Venezuelan history and culture and traits with my good Colombian friend and your assessment is right in line with his general beliefs.

My take is that it maybe more of an arrogance than rudeness, perhaps a mix of both.

Well now look at what they have become, their country is in shambles yet despite this the 20 something year olds here in Medellin have an arrogance about them and they are homeless and without 20 mil in their pockets yet they believe they are above the Colombians.

If I was one of these 20 something who has fled their country instead of staying put and fighting for their country and honor I would, rather I should be really pissed at my parents and grandparents for supporting and sitting back allowing this government to take root.

They got themselves into this mess now the run to Colombia and with an attitude on their shoulder.

Yes I know the whole history of Gran Colombia and Bolivar and the multitude of Colombians that fled to Venezuela when thing were bad and I also learned that Colombian were treated like second class people in Venezuela during those really tough years.

And I have also volunteered my time and resources and energy in Cucuta twice last year so I get the issues and have seen them first hand.

Life goes on.

Blenheim
  3/4/2020 22:03 EST

Eggs in Colombia etc etc outside U.S--

For the deviled egg lovers--

The result of Eggs not being refrigerated at the store ---Carulla-Exito---Olympia---Jumbo--finca farm-and everywhere else----

If eggs are not refrigerated the egg yolks by gravity fall to near the bottom of the raw egg white --now when the egg is boiled --the yoke is cooked off centered in the white (albumen)-
So when cut in half with the yolk removed--one side of the egg white is thin and the other half is wider due to the off center of the yolk----which means one side of the white is weaker than the other side--
Now when filling the white with the yolk-mustard -mayo mix etc-- the finished egg half is very weak and easily comes apart when the filling is incorporated----a messy situation trying to eat--

Now the good news--most Colombians do not even know what deviled eggs are--so when eating one they comment on the taste--and not aware it is not supposed to come apart in the process--

SkyMan
  3/5/2020 11:46 EST

CAtoMDE...I agree with your post concerning the veneco's rudeness. While strolling a very small store in the el hueco shopping district here in Medellín, as I was looking at items, as I slowly walked toward the exit...the veneco said in Spanish..."If you not going to buy, get out". I will not post what I told him in Spanish...but I very slowly walked out...what a rude group ! These venecos are very fortunate that Duque even allowed em in, and they come with that crap-attitude. Buena Suerte !

morganstern
  3/20/2020 06:58 EST

Back to prices.....The best fillet of chicken breast cut to order costs $1.41/pound in butcher shop in B.A.

SkyMan
  3/20/2020 10:21 EST

morganstern...the big questions is....Do you like it in Buenos Aires thus far ? Other than the financial aspects...how do you compare it with Colombia ? Friendliness of the people, shopping, dining ? Buena Suerte !

augieman
  3/20/2020 22:36 EST

Finally someone states the truth


way to go elexpat

morganstern
  3/21/2020 06:06 EST

To compare Colombia vs Argentina.....first, I hate to stereotype but the people in Argentina are extremely unfriendly compared to Colombians. Go into a hardware store and you might get ignored. People on the streets are extremely indifferent to others. If I was looking for women or ANY kind of relationship this would be the last place I would choose.

The city from what I know of it, which is not a lot, is gorgeous. Tree lined boulevards, clean streets, not nearly the number of motorcycles compared to cars that you see in Colombia. The taxis are all larger than those in Col and thus much more comfortable. Taxis are plentiful (and the weather is good). Supermarkets in Colombia (Jumbo) are more attractive than those here, or so it seems. There are tons and tons of restaurants, bakery coffee places, pizza places...they are everywhere and look homey and inviting. I really only know one tourist area, San Telmo, and I love the place and want to live there. The main plaza is where people sit at tables, drink coffee or anything else actually and watch tango dancers perform for tips. The central market (indoor) two blocks away has all the restaurants that I need as a non-cooker.

There is much more 'life' here than in Colombia, any city in Colombia. And the prices make it just so doable. Even with the recent drop in Col peso this place is much cheaper. The price of food is unbelievably cheap.

I miss my Sanitas, (still have it), and still consider Colombia my home. I am studying health care here and know a little about it. But I would bet it is not as good as Col. Just a guess.
Life is MUCH more interesting here in Argentina. Pura Vida

morganstern
  3/21/2020 06:23 EST

Restaurants.....there is no comparison. I have had great dinners in nice places for $4 and the menu selections are WAY more civilized than anything in Colombia. I don't like most menus in Colombia. Here they are much more inclusive. I miss my Mcdonalds breakfast sausage....crazy. And finding American type breakfast food in restaurants seems difficult. A steak at home for lunch, not huge but good quality, cost less than a can of tuna that I bought. The tuna cost about $2.00...the steak less. You can find lots of ethnic food stores here. It is much more worldly than Colombia. Wine is so cheap you can use it to clean the floors.

Apartments....I live in an Airbnb with a longer term deal with the owner ($500). I am pretty sure AB is somewhat cheaper than Colombia overall. I am also learning, not 100% versed, that renting apartments is not the SOB experience of Colombia. I am talking about the fiodora problem. Actually, I am sure it easier because in Colombia it can be impossible.

And to all in Colombia I wish you health and safety in these difficult times.

morganstern
  3/21/2020 16:09 EST

And here is a cute little secret. If you use NUMBEO for a price comparison between Colombia and Argentina.....the Argentine price is compared using a value for the peso in the low sixties per dollar. But when you, being the smart gringo that you are, use Western Union for about $10....you receive 89 pesos per dollar! That means you get 25 free pesos per dollar you convert and that does no show up in the Numbeo software. Pura Vida

Elexpatriado
  3/22/2020 10:05 EST

augieman..

I always tell the truth..thats why some people dont like me...

You should look up a guy named Terrence Popp

He is a bit extreme and negative ,... but a lot of truthful stuff.. and funny

Andresen
  3/22/2020 11:31 EST

Don't believe people who "have a hunch". Hopefully after a few weeks of no new infections they can allow more internal movement.

Elexpatriado
  3/22/2020 14:36 EST

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

Have a look at these graphs and stats Andreson..look at several different countriesv n Europe, Asia,North and South America

If you understand Mathematics , statistics and trends and have any logical common sense you will see how ludicrous it is to assume there will be " no new cases" in a couple weeks..

Not saying this is probably still blown out of proportion., but if Colombias infection rate is 5 per million, what will the reaction be when it is 5o or 100 like Ecuadors who have been in quarantine for 9 days already?

WhoaNellie
  3/22/2020 15:09 EST

LX opined
"what will the reaction be when it is 5o or 100 like Ecuadors..."

Ecuador is now at 532 cases Sunday, 3/22/2020 and will undoubtedly climb some more:

https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6

Andresen
  3/22/2020 15:53 EST

ElEx. Hope dies last.

Elexpatriado
  3/22/2020 17:36 EST

Read my post and the site . I am talking about cases per million

Elexpatriado
  3/22/2020 19:56 EST

Hope dies Last

Thats what a girl told here when I told her last Tuesday it ws very ulikely that she would be going on her Company trip to Sana Marta this long weekend.

Its good to be optimistic, but dont get hung up on dreams and fantasies beyond your control.

I think there is a zero to 10 percent chance I will be going on my planned 6 week trip to Canada this summer, starting in July, and I had a lot of things planned.

Have to prepare yourself for the most likely loguical outcome, which some would say is the worst outcome...

Elexpatriado
  3/22/2020 19:58 EST

Hope dies Last

Thats what a girl told here when I told her last Tuesday it ws very ulikely that she would be going on her Company trip to Sana Marta this long weekend.

Its good to be optimistic, but dont get hung up on dreams and fantasies beyond your control.

I think there is a zero to 10 percent chance I will be going on my planned 6 week trip to Canada this summer, starting in July, and I had a lot of things planned.

Have to prepare yourself for the most likely loguical outcome, which some would say is the worst outcome...

morganstern
  4/3/2020 07:06 EST

Well back to the comparison of Colombia and Argentina......the official peso is about 64 for a cost basis in the markets....through Western Union from the U.S. I get 86. And then yesterday at the supermarket the cashier gave me an additional 10% discount being a senior. I have never experienced food costs like this. It means that the best steaks cost $1.80 a pound. If anyone needs a check of a specific item let me know.

SkyMan
  4/3/2020 12:41 EST

morganstern.....How's this virus-thing being handled in Buenos Aires ? Are you guys under any type of quarantine or Pico/Shopping restrictions ? Great prices on "tender" steaks & I do love a nice filet...making me hungry as I type.
Stay Well. Buena Suerte !

morganstern
  4/3/2020 18:27 EST

Hi Skyman....STRICT quarantine. There was an article in Bloomberg news the other day about how everyone admired how Argentina has done this. People REALLY respect the law. Almost no cars on the road...and they will arrest you when stopped and you don't have the exclusion forms. There are police walking all over the neighborhoods. When I go to the market they are visible. The markets are full...no problems. Maybe a few brands are out...but no problem. Western Union has been closed...bad for me. But there is no use for money. Quick calculation....the market bill yesterday was $48 for regular people...with my blue dollars....$35 and then they gave me another 10% as a pensionado (of Colombia)

SkyMan
  4/4/2020 11:35 EST

Morganstern...Here in Medellín and most all of Colombia I think...We are under a Pico/Cedula shopping schedule(2 days per week for supermarket/banking). As I entered Jumbo & Carulla supermarkets, they had employees checking the last number on the Cedula, to make sure it's your correct day. Both stores were well-stocked in every aisle...fresh veggie & fruits/freshly cut meats & yes tons of toilet paper as well. Stay Well. Buena Suerte !

morganstern
  4/18/2020 19:34 EST

Well I have not gone out at all really.....just to the supermarket and a short walk around the neighborhood. The peso has dropped exactly 20% since February 1st. From 80 to 100/dollar. And then as a senior another 10% off at the supermarket. Otherwise I know nothing. Obviously the country is in trouble. When a person has a cd due at the bank they can only get 24% interest now. Inflation is over 50%. So they want dollars...and the bank can only give them $200 per month. Terrible for the people and you have to wonder about the stability of it all as time goes on. An ugly time for all of us. Pura Vida

Elexpatriado
  4/19/2020 10:14 EST

Morganstern

When I was there there was a shortage of ATMs..and they all charged. And the stupid Blue market thing-who can walk around with $1000 or $2000 US? First of all, if you kive ther permanenly, how do you transfer it? Are northe American Bank machines allowed?

In Colombia you can use a zero charge ATMs with Zero Charge North American Credit or Debit Card and get the Visa International Exchange rate on ATM withdrawals at selected Bank ATMs (Davivienda and Colpatria) , and the same rate on Visa Purchases. Best rate and very convenient.


Argentinas bank system seems really screwed up, complicated and inconvenient. How do you transfer money getting the maximum exchange rate , minimum charges, and maximum convenience in Argentina.

Electricista
  4/19/2020 11:10 EST

Currency controls to restrict to $200.00 USD. I remember this was done in Venezuela during Chavez. The black market for USD then flourished.

Exchange rate above 100 ARS pesos to $1 US given by WU

"On April 6, Argentina defers payments of up to US$9.8 billion on its local public debt until 2021 in response to the corona virus crisis. — AFP"

Appears to be very interesting times in Argentina.

morganstern
  4/19/2020 11:24 EST

Money transfer....Colombia yes is wonderful using a no charge debit card at the Colpatria/Scotiabank machines. But something as interesting as hell....in Argentina there is the official peso.....then there is the Blue peso which is easily purchased if you have dollars....but forget it! Believe it or not using Western Union, for the past 2 months, you get about 10 peso MORE than the blue. Someone, or maybe yourself, sends you dollars...you pick up your pesos depending on what is open. For further info check out the WU website.

Elexpatriado
  4/20/2020 09:22 EST

Still more hassle than an ATM..Morg..have to wait in line at the WU office

And you cant use credit Cards, except in emergency, because they give you the lower "Official" Rate rather than "Blue" I imagine

morganstern
  4/20/2020 10:35 EST

Still more hassle than an ATM..Morg..have to wait in line at the WU office

....nope...not if you are over 60

Have an emergency....don't have one. (nothing is easier than Colombia, yes, but this WU premium deal is not bad either)

SkyMan
  4/20/2020 10:55 EST

As I was passing by the Western Union office here in Medellín the other day..there was a long, long line of paisas waiting to receive $$$ from family in the U.S.(since the locals are not working right now)... that's what one of the security guards told me. Stay Well All. Buena Suerte !

Elexpatriado
  4/20/2020 12:41 EST

There is a Davivienda and Colpatria cajero 2 minutes walk from my place, and only one other guy in from¡nt of me.

Can imagine trying o find a WU office all the time

Not to mention somebody would notice your pattern, whereas my Cajero withdrawals are very erretic

ponymalta2
  4/20/2020 15:24 EST

Elexpatriado

i agree who wants to go to Western Union office for funds except in emergency. I have online WUI account to send funds, and I notice it says they can credit bank account as well- but I have never used, and knowing how difficult it is for WUI to correct an error, I probably would avoid.

If someone has a British bank account many charge a flat rate to send, and seem to give better exchange rates, and usually funds in Colombian bank the same day. I still think easier just use an ATM card.

morganstern
  4/20/2020 19:26 EST

In each country you transfer as best you can .....period. Colombia is the easiest.

Elexpatriado
  4/21/2020 13:59 EST

True Morg..we are just being "Dopes of the Day"..jajajaja

morganstern
  5/6/2020 10:30 EST

To continue comparing the two....I saw a dermatologist this morning at a private clinic. $7.33 + $1.25 for a blood test. No...that is not a typographical error. And she spoke English! Weird.

Elexpatriado
  5/7/2020 17:49 EST

My friend saw a GP in Mexico for about $1. Prescribed him exactly what he needed to fix his problem . Another place with a fancy office

Elexpatriado
  5/8/2020 14:02 EST

Finish my post. I was interupted.

Another place with a fancy office wanted to charge him $100 equivelent(Real gringo prices.

morganstern
  5/8/2020 18:17 EST

1.00 USD = 116.7600 Argentine Peso (ARS) 2

morganstern
  5/8/2020 18:20 EST

Elexpatriado...knows zero about WU in Buenos Aires....nor about medical costs in Mexico. H'll offer something of value.....one of these days.

Electricista
  5/8/2020 20:29 EST

"1.00 USD = 116.7600 Argentine Peso (ARS) 2 "

Are things becoming cheaper with the devalued currency or are the prices going up every week to reflect inflation?

morganstern
  5/9/2020 07:29 EST

Electicita.....the cost of food could never go up anything like the pace of the peso going down. And...I think....the faster pace of depreciation these days is because of a big bond debt coming due. But in everyday life the people have no idea what is happening with the peso against the dollar. And I have been limited in circulation so prices on things are something I dont know much about. Rents in my cases are tied to the dollar...but again...I am very knowledgeable as I use Airbnb (I know a lot about AB)

Electricista
  5/9/2020 09:57 EST

I assume anything domestically made, including food, will go up slowly while imported products will go through the roof or will not be available.

Elexpatriado
  5/10/2020 09:27 EST

Are you saying my friend is lieing? That is what he paid for a 5 minute cita with a GP in Mexico

No I don knoe how WU works in Argentina , other than what you told e.

Sounds good if I ever live there,or even travel again I wl try it out

All I said is it isnt as convenient as Colombia or Ecuador, where the exchange rate is allowed to float and you can use a no charge Debit Card at a no or low charge bank ATM

I hate WU line ups. Now it is really bad

morganstern
  5/15/2020 15:26 EST

Yesterday was one for the record books. The BLUE peso traded at exactly double the 'regular' peso. If someone with access to dollars buys something for $100 in pesos.....I can buy two of them. Sorry for the people...and it will probably get worse. These potential discounts are not necessarily reflected in the rental market.

Electricista
  5/15/2020 16:58 EST

I see what you mean. Online I am seeing today 121.05 WU rate vs 67.66 official rate.

I see online that “The Dollar in Argentina is used for three main things: Savings, real estate, and imported vehicles.”

LaPiranha
  5/15/2020 23:06 EST

Yeah, but its always been like that in Argentina. They have defaulted on their debts so many times over the past years, and the rampant devaluation of their currency has often been encouraged, as they will have to pay back less on their loans which are contracted in Argentinian Pesos.

Colombia and other Latin American countries did the same thing in the mid to late 1900's. For example, they take out a 100 billion peso loan, then when they devalue the currency by 20%, the 100 billion they pay back is actually only what was 80 billion previously. It was common practice.

You make notes, and you'll find that your Argentinian money buys less and less as time goes by. The devaluation is not as bad as Venezuela's at the moment, but it continues unabated. One day you'll need a wheelbarrow to go and buy a loaf of bread. But they will probably re-align their currency (again) well before then, and the decline starts anew.

Electricista
  5/16/2020 08:32 EST

Yes we have all read about the "wheelbarrow to go and buy a loaf of bread" in 1922 Germany. But it is the "ride" that is interesting. To be there enjoying the benefits of a devaluing currency. I experienced it in Brazil and in PRC when they had two currencies. I wish I had bought land in China at that time.

peterv123
  5/16/2020 08:57 EST

looks like a lot of their debt is in dollars....

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"The official government bulletin announcing the new measures said a significant percentage of Argentina’s debt was in foreign currencies, principally the US dollar. A government spokesman said since the dollar was not Argentina’s currency, the dollar debt presented different problems and therefore had to be treated differently in terms of repayment. "

eybaba7200
  5/16/2020 12:17 EST

I have been to Colombia 5 times and only once in Argentina. I can say from my experience for the same quality of life you pay much higher costs in Buenos Aires than Bogota or Medellin. The economy in Argentina is a mess but in colombia is growing at a steady mess. With the inflation and currency and the way the government handles things i would stay clear from living in Argentina for now.

LaPiranha
  5/16/2020 12:54 EST

I agree Peter. Many countries have been burnt by loaning Argentina money, repayable in Argentinian currency, so that many countries are now insisting its in another or neutral currency, often US$.

But as Electricista says, you can enjoy the ride while it lasts, and you can even find opportunities that might protect you, like buying property or land, but its still a hellova risk, as any government can change the rules, just like that, when it gets serious. But you can't depend on that ride for ever. Eventually it all comes crashing down. The aim is not to get caught up in it when the sh1t hits the fan. It can get pretty violent too.

Elexpatriado
  5/16/2020 13:25 EST

LaPiranah

With all this "Helicopter Money " ging around, this will happen all over the world to some degree.

Inflation willoccur everywhere eventually, But Expats have the choice of living in a developing country with a worse situation than thierown and gain on the exchange rate.

LaPiranha
  5/16/2020 19:42 EST

Indeed, it will happen all over the world to some extent, but its been happening in Argentina for many decades. When you add the current impending recession/inflation/austerity to their existing economic problems, it may be a lot harder

And yes, expats have the choice, but there might be many more pitfalls in a country with a worse economic situation than in a more stable country, even if the exchange rate seems favourable at first. It may be a very short term gain, followed by long term hardship. Just advise caution, and be prepared to evacuate.

morganstern
  7/22/2020 09:33 EST

More on Argentina cost of living....I saw a neurologist at Argentina's leading hospital....$22.00. I had a tomografi exam....$130. All of this would no doubt have been cheaper at a different hospital. I now live in Recoleta which is one of best neighborhoods in B.A. There are lots of local real estate offices and they post their listings in the window. Rarely did a listing for an apartment get to $300 (converted) many many were $150-$275. The $200-$300 were 2 and 3 bedroom apartments...I assume nearby. Of course there are the dumb agreement problems that might resemble Colombia, though I think it is easier for a foreigner to rent here.

Energyexpert
  7/22/2020 11:36 EST

Argentina will always be a currency devaluation nightmere until every Facist Socialist Commumist is dead and buried and more keep popping up every day. So that is never going to happen. Expots and imports effect places too. Plus currency manipulation by mega banks and the governments. Thats besides the narco gang problems so you have to include those factors. I am sad to say l did not and watched half my life saving die in Australua whose currency because of China GDP exports being 75% watch their currency go from a USD 1.07 to USD .68 since 2011 and the NOR Krone lose 60% and the Euro 40%. even Silver lose 45%. So never look at that and you can't depend on the USD as it's sinking like the SS Titanic. Bitcoin and Gold stored safe in Grand Cayman's SWP vaults can somewhat give you shelter from the storms.

SkyMan
  7/22/2020 12:12 EST

So Morganstern...Are you still enjoying living in Buenos Aires ? I recall you posted the prices of Prime Beef earlier and Argentine Beef...Oh My ! Great Flavor and Taste. Stay Well. Buena Suerte !

jo12208
  7/22/2020 15:19 EST

Doesn't Visa have a 1% fee?

jo12208
  7/22/2020 15:19 EST

Doesn't Visa have a 1% fee?

jo12208
  7/22/2020 15:31 EST

For cash withdrawals?

jo12208
  7/22/2020 15:31 EST

For cash withdrawals?

morganstern
  7/23/2020 08:18 EST

Cash withdrawals?? Don't know as I only use Western Union. Do I like it here? I love the city but my exposure is almost nil. The weather is great...now cold but very dry cold so walking is a pleasure. The city is flat, the buildings are really beautiful....and the people generally suck. Especially as everyone everywhere has a mask on. Life's expectations have changed...that's for sure. So my life's experience here is just about the basics....supermarkets etc. No restaurants are open with seating...take out only. And you have to wear a mask.

nubrain
  7/23/2020 19:05 EST

A Cubana "jinitera" once told me that the tourist clients pay well, get themselves off in 5 minutes, and leave; while local Cuban clients would pay much less, bang the hell out of her for an hour or so, and leave her almost unable to walk

jajjaaj

Elexpatriado
  7/24/2020 10:41 EST

Nubrain

This is off topic

But Cubans on the Island are the biggest scammers around. Actually the puniest.

Their scams are so corny and ridiculous..and theythink they are so smart when they dupe you $5 for a cigar or a meal at a restaurant ·they "recommend"

They should send dishonest Colombians there to teach them how to be more astute and manipulative at scamming.

If they wouldnt try all those phoney, corny 2 bit scams, and were more honest,they would probably have a lot more tourists helping them and their families out financially..

morganstern
  8/22/2020 20:43 EST

The Argentine peso appears to be in a free fall. It was 80 or so when I got here and the blue is now 132 delivered via Western Union. My last transfers were done at 120 then 127 in the past few weeks. This is a scarry decline in my book. Sure it make things cheaper and cheaper but I really wish this decline would slow down. They are going to write history books I'm afraid before this is done.

SkyMan
  8/23/2020 11:19 EST

Wow ! Sounds like the Argentine peso is diving fast...not ever good news. The virus continues to strike body-blows on the world's economies. This economic carnage will be felt for a while. It's estimated that here in Colombia 30% of all restaurants will not ever reopen....and that's a lot of jobs gone. There are some pilot-programs with some restaurants open now, but w/25% of seating capacity the owners will pay the bills, but that's about all. Stay Well. Buena Suerte

Tiopepe
  8/26/2020 13:52 EST

Bill Bonner writes a daily article about his life on a ranch in Argentina. Here is todays:

https://www.rogueeconomics.com/bill-bonner-diary/turning-to-argentina-for-insight-into-americas-future/

"We are blessed by having to wait out the coronavirus here in Argentina. We didn’t plan it. But that’s the way it has worked out.

And it gives us a chance to look more closely at how you can destroy an economy with government policy.

How the Federal Reserve must envy the Argentine central bank – these guys know how to create inflation!"


An insight into Colombias future as well

Electricista
  8/26/2020 22:13 EST

I used to think that the size of the national debt was the biggest factor. Now I realize that the interest rate on the debt is what really matters, Both USA and Canada are not crashing because the interest rate is really low. They now pay less on the now larger debt than previously on the smaller pre-covid19 debt because interest rates hit the floor.

On the other hand Argentina's interest rate is at 40% or above.

Turbocolombia
  9/1/2020 04:34 EST

I owned a house in Longchamps Barrio Buenos Aires, a strong Italian Area. since 1989. The Buenos Aires currency and politics have being up and down so much you could loose a fortune. What is Great now in Buenos Aires may not last forever or another month.. As a owner since 1989 in Buenos Aires i could never recuperate my investment period. The reality of living in Buenos Aires is not as you can compare living in Colombia or Peru. In the final accounting stage, Buenos Aires is expensive as the final accounting spreadsheet will show.. Buenos aires is expensive in the majority of expenses.

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